• No_Change_Just_Money@feddit.de
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    6 months ago

    You could reduce meat intake and buy higher quality meat whenever financially feasible. Then you help fight the problem but can still look down on vegans

    • illi@lemm.ee
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      6 months ago

      This is solid advice, but… you know… don’t look down on vegans maybe? They are trying to do the same thing (reduce animal suffering) but are able/willing to go above and beyond.

      • illi@lemm.ee
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        6 months ago

        Small incremental changes are easier to make than big ones. It is also better to have many people reducing meat than just a few full vegans.

        • Doll_Tow_Jet-ski@kbin.social
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          6 months ago

          The word easier here is a choice. What is more comfortable is easier, but eating a plant based diet is very easy. It’s cheaper and widely available in most countries. What you mean by easier really refers to more comfortable, not really to there being less physical obstacles

          • SirQuackTheDuck@lemmy.world
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            6 months ago

            not really to there being less physical obstacles

            Depends on availability. Plenty of eateries don’t have vegan options and this is especially true for locations accommodating larger groups. Furthermore, a lot of vegans need supplements (as I’ve been told), which is also subject to availability.

            Lastly, it’s easier to convince a thousand people to eat less meat – especially since they usually already have the ingredients required for vegetarian food at home – than to skip meat alltogether.

            Two thousand meals a week that turned vegetarian is a lot more impact than 70 meals turned vegan.

            • MrScottyTay@sh.itjust.works
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              6 months ago

              It’s not that a lot of vegans need supplements, they’re just more aware of what the body should get, when in fact almost everyone likely needs supplements. They just don’t know it.

            • Doll_Tow_Jet-ski@kbin.social
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              6 months ago

              Plenty of eateries don’t have vegan options

              Maybe you are thinking of processed vegan food, like a vegan nugget or hamburger. That is completely unnecessary. beans, lentils, chickpeas, seaweed, grains, rice, vegetables, nuts… those are widely available and enough for a healthy diet.

              For the rest I agree, it’s easier to convince an omnivore to go vegetarian than vegan. But that has to do with their will, not with actual physical limitations.

          • illi@lemm.ee
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            6 months ago

            It is easy once you are in, know what are the good vegan meals and how to cook them etc. Most people will have animal product for each meal - they don’t know better. To them vegans just eat salads and nuts, which is obviously not enticing. If they don’t take the easy way, they will just continue the only way they know how and change nothing.

            • Doll_Tow_Jet-ski@kbin.social
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              6 months ago

              I agree with you. I guess the difference lies in that I would call that laziness. Not knowing how to eat balanced meals (or more precisely, not looking it up), it’s not a matter of it being hard or easy. It’s a matter of simply doing it. All the information is out there and at a level anyone who can read will understand

              • illi@lemm.ee
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                6 months ago

                I mean, you are not wrong. In a way easy way is always the lazy way - doesn’t mean it is wrong. It can be daunting. Some people will take the fast, but hard way. Some people will take the longer/ but easy. If you end up in same destination, it’s a win in the end.

                • Doll_Tow_Jet-ski@kbin.social
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                  6 months ago

                  Some people will take the fast, but hard way. Some people will take the longer/ but easy. If you end up in same destination, it’s a win in the end.

                  I guess you meant to say fast but easy, or longer but hard, right?

                  • illi@lemm.ee
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                    6 months ago

                    I meant fast as in complete veganism overnight (hard) over slow, gradual change to eventually get to complete veganism (easier).

                    It’s not the usual way the phrase goes I guess, or I just worded it badly

          • Senokir@lemmy.world
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            6 months ago

            In my experience they often do go vegan overnight though. The key tends to be actually connecting the food on your plate with where it came from and accepting that animals are capable of suffering. Once that connection is made, animal products simply aren’t seen as food anymore and going vegan overnight is the only logical conclusion.

            Some people may be further along the spectrum towards being vegan when this connection is actually made but regardless of if you are vegetarian, “only eat free range meat”, or an unapologetic meat eater, once the connection is made they are vegan.

            • illi@lemm.ee
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              6 months ago

              “only eat free range meat”

              these people are by definiton not vegan. Trying to be more ethical by their choices, which is commendable - but not vegan.

              • Senokir@lemmy.world
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                6 months ago

                Yes, that is my point. Whether someone is vegetarian, “trying to be more ethical” but still eating meat, or just a meat eater that has never even considered ethics, there is nothing that says you have to go through all of those steps to becoming vegan. In my experience, regardless of how far along you are in those “steps” once you make the connection between the food on your plate and the animals that it comes from and you realize that they are suffering for you, you go vegan. That could be meat eater to vegan, “ethical” meat eater to vegan, or vegetarian to vegan. My point is that in my experience that process does happen overnight.

                • illi@lemm.ee
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                  6 months ago

                  Well it’s not universal. For some it does, for some it doesn’t.

          • illi@lemm.ee
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            6 months ago

            I mean… reducing meat is how people would go vegan over longer period if time (as opposed to over night) though? Not sure where you were going with your original comment.

      • No_Change_Just_Money@feddit.de
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        6 months ago

        You will get more people to join your cause with a positive message: i.g. “Do these small steps to start” than a negative one, I.g. “If you don’t go fully vegan, you are still part of the problem.”

        “Perfect is the enemy of good.”

        So it is easier to convince people to reduce meat consumption, which than makes it more likely that people will go vegetarian or vegan later

        And i actually feel like vegans on the internet can be too aggressive, alienating people they could get on their side

        • flerp@lemm.ee
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          6 months ago

          Your comment is about looking down on people… tongue in cheek or not, this is always the kind of stuff people post before complaining that the big mean vegans are alienating them… victim complex much?

        • davepleasebehave@lemmy.world
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          6 months ago

          best is the enemy of better.

          why are you giving vegans advice on how to market veganism? if the facts won’t change your mind then it’s not the fault of the vegans.

            • davepleasebehave@lemmy.world
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              6 months ago

              I also want more vegans. there is no right way to change someone’s mind. attack the problem from different angles is my view.

              All compassion is good compassion

          • No_Change_Just_Money@feddit.de
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            6 months ago

            Of course facts can be aggressive

            Let’s assume you talk to someone from a first world country. It is aggressive to say your lifestyle is responsible for the death of children in the developmental world, you are indirectly a murderer

            It is more helpful to say: try fair-trade chlothes and check for companies that you buy from

            Dividing society does not help better it

    • Emerald@lemmy.world
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      6 months ago

      If your goal when choosing what to eat is “look down on vegans”, then you have a really shitty way of choosing what to eat.