Fuck Assad, he could have simply chosen to not order shooting at peaceful protesters in 2011 and overseen a peaceful transition to democracy. Instead, he chose death and destruction for millions of people. He deserves everything that’s coming to him, and Syrians everywhere have every right to celebrate tonight.
The future is uncertain: this is what freedom looks like. My entire heart goes out to the Syrian people. Hopefully the maniacs leading the HTS and the SNA will not manage to smother them.
This is not “what freedom looks like” this is “what a violent rebellion looks like”. There are good odds that the new regime will be as bad or even worse. People who overthrow a power with military force aren’t often interested in sharing that power afterwards.
I mean very narrowly this moment right now. This moment of uncertainty where anything is possible. This is what freedom looks like: anything is possible, the best and the worst.
I gotcha - though I personally wouldn’t choose the word “freedom” for that. “Uncertainty” is more appropriate I’d say. The future of the nation will be up to the rebels, not the people. They won’t get any say unless the new regime lets them.
“The king is dead! Long live the king!” and all that…
I don’t know what to tell you - people always think there must be a “good” option, and if the current one is bad then any other option must therefore be good.
This could also be a radical regime like the Taliban that could actually be worse for most people.
What is untrue? My concern? How can my concern be “untrue?”
The skills needed to be a revolutionary are very different from the skills needed to govern. Remember when the taliban was “kinder and softer” for a few months?
I’ll be happy if my concern is misplaced. But time will tell.
The idea that they “could be” ignores the fact that they’ve been actively governing their territories since (and before, I guess) 2017, and they haven’t started a Taliban-style brutal regime there. I mean I guess it’s not impossible for them to suddenly change their style of governing, but what I’m trying to say that they have a track record we can use to try and predict their future behavior.
So maybe next time have a conversation rather than just telling somebody “that’s untrue”? No need to be weirdly adversarial…
That said - you raise some good points. I’m not ignoring anything though. You’re acting like my “concern” is saying “things will go bad” when it’s not.
Well… Yeah. But do the rebels care about that? Or do they just feel that Asad was just torturing and murdering the wrong people? And do they feel that Assad was just not following the koran closely enough by allowing women to be educated?
Rebellion against oppression often leads to a different type of oppression, and given the groups these rebels have been associated with in the past it’s concerning at least.
The are a rebranding of Al-Nusra, a split of Al-Quaeda.
They’re a split of Al-Qaeda in Iraq, who was mostly (or only??? Idk) fighting the US invasion, so that doesn’t say much. Also from what I have read they’ve been keeping their promise of civil liberties in their territories. So what I want to say is: Have they done something or does anyone who’s not secular enough qualify as a maniac?
We are not talking about “not secular enough” here, we are talking about Al-Quaeda, get a grip. The leader guy had made an oath of allegiance to al-Zawahiri. Al-Nusra at times collaborated then fought against ISIS. They were also responsible for war crimes: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Al-Nusra_Front#War_crimes
Regardless, like I also said they are putting on a moderate face and say they are different. But minority groups in Syria are rightly feeling threatened.
Minority groups in Aleppo welcomed them and said they feels safe. Whether this will last has yet to manifest, but probably the main dividing line would be Sunni-Shia.
Also protection of minorities is a fundamental islamic value. People like Daesh bastardize Islam.
We are not talking about “not secular enough” here, we are talking about Al-Quaeda, get a grip.
Again, we’re talking about Al-Qaeda in Iraq, and the now leader/founder of HTS joined them to fight against the US invasion of Iraq. Not saying they’re good guys or not, but in this context “they’re Al-Qaeda” isn’t saying much. This sort of bad word logic doesn’t really check out with reality.
Fuck Assad, he could have simply chosen to not order shooting at peaceful protesters in 2011 and overseen a peaceful transition to democracy. Instead, he chose death and destruction for millions of people. He deserves everything that’s coming to him, and Syrians everywhere have every right to celebrate tonight.
The future is uncertain: this is what freedom looks like. My entire heart goes out to the Syrian people. Hopefully the maniacs leading the HTS and the SNA will not manage to smother them.
This is not “what freedom looks like” this is “what a violent rebellion looks like”. There are good odds that the new regime will be as bad or even worse. People who overthrow a power with military force aren’t often interested in sharing that power afterwards.
I mean very narrowly this moment right now. This moment of uncertainty where anything is possible. This is what freedom looks like: anything is possible, the best and the worst.
I gotcha - though I personally wouldn’t choose the word “freedom” for that. “Uncertainty” is more appropriate I’d say. The future of the nation will be up to the rebels, not the people. They won’t get any say unless the new regime lets them.
“The king is dead! Long live the king!” and all that…
The other option: overthrow the violent regime with magic.
I don’t know what to tell you - people always think there must be a “good” option, and if the current one is bad then any other option must therefore be good.
This could also be a radical regime like the Taliban that could actually be worse for most people.
This is untrue considering their track record after the rebranding from Al-Nusra to HTS. They’re not spawning out of thin air.
What is untrue? My concern? How can my concern be “untrue?”
The skills needed to be a revolutionary are very different from the skills needed to govern. Remember when the taliban was “kinder and softer” for a few months?
I’ll be happy if my concern is misplaced. But time will tell.
The idea that they “could be” ignores the fact that they’ve been actively governing their territories since (and before, I guess) 2017, and they haven’t started a Taliban-style brutal regime there. I mean I guess it’s not impossible for them to suddenly change their style of governing, but what I’m trying to say that they have a track record we can use to try and predict their future behavior.
So maybe next time have a conversation rather than just telling somebody “that’s untrue”? No need to be weirdly adversarial…
That said - you raise some good points. I’m not ignoring anything though. You’re acting like my “concern” is saying “things will go bad” when it’s not.
That… is fair enough.
Wasn’t my intention to be adversarial but that is also fair enough.
What about this: the status quo under Assad with houndred of thousands tortured and murdered is bad enough to try to change it.
Removed by mod
Well… Yeah. But do the rebels care about that? Or do they just feel that Asad was just torturing and murdering the wrong people? And do they feel that Assad was just not following the koran closely enough by allowing women to be educated?
Rebellion against oppression often leads to a different type of oppression, and given the groups these rebels have been associated with in the past it’s concerning at least.
You just write down what pops up in you mind.
Where are your sources for those claims?
What claims? You just say things that pop in your mind too. Where are your sources?
Why are the HTS maniacs again?
The are a rebranding of Al-Nusra, a split of Al-Quaeda.
This is their leader: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abu_Mohammad_al-Julani
They are putting on a “moderate” face, it remains to be seen if they mean it.
They’re a split of Al-Qaeda in Iraq, who was mostly (or only??? Idk) fighting the US invasion, so that doesn’t say much. Also from what I have read they’ve been keeping their promise of civil liberties in their territories. So what I want to say is: Have they done something or does anyone who’s not secular enough qualify as a maniac?
We are not talking about “not secular enough” here, we are talking about Al-Quaeda, get a grip. The leader guy had made an oath of allegiance to al-Zawahiri. Al-Nusra at times collaborated then fought against ISIS. They were also responsible for war crimes: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Al-Nusra_Front#War_crimes
Regardless, like I also said they are putting on a moderate face and say they are different. But minority groups in Syria are rightly feeling threatened.
Minority groups in Aleppo welcomed them and said they feels safe. Whether this will last has yet to manifest, but probably the main dividing line would be Sunni-Shia.
Also protection of minorities is a fundamental islamic value. People like Daesh bastardize Islam.
Again, we’re talking about Al-Qaeda in Iraq, and the now leader/founder of HTS joined them to fight against the US invasion of Iraq. Not saying they’re good guys or not, but in this context “they’re Al-Qaeda” isn’t saying much. This sort of bad word logic doesn’t really check out with reality.
Okay fair enough that’s maniac material. That said, don’t they have a good enough track record as HTS starting 2017?
Well, you know the movie reference: Illinois Nazis, I hate Illinois Nazis.
Anyway, we’ll find out soon enough what these guys are.