• kreskin@lemmy.world
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    11 days ago

    Targetted military installations, Israel said. But seems they instead hit residential apartment complexes. So, yet another war crime.

    • xenomor@lemmy.world
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      11 days ago

      Well this is Israel’s big skillset. They are a culture organized around the oppression and murder of innocents.

      • Samskara@sh.itjust.works
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        10 days ago

        Iranian revolutionary guard generals are not innocent and actually quite good at oppression.

        • xenomor@lemmy.world
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          10 days ago

          Well, I never said they were. They aren’t the only ones being targeted. The kind of pedantic excuse crafting that you’re doing right here, is the kind of nonsensical rationalization that is always deployed when that vicious, violent, predatory nation does what it always does.

    • Monument@lemmy.sdf.org
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      10 days ago

      But like, did you see how menacing the curtains looked?!?

      I sent a screenshot of that to my people earlier - highlighting the discrepancy. It’s astounding how blatantly the media carries water for them.

    • hoch@lemmy.world
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      10 days ago

      I hate to sound like I’m defending Israel, but it’s possible Iran shot down some of their missiles, which have to go somewhere. It’s looking like the vast majority of the strikes were aiming for military targets.

      • kreskin@lemmy.world
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        10 days ago

        Israel admitted they targetted apartment buildings where leaders lived. Its not a missile shootdown.

      • LifeInMultipleChoice@lemmy.world
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        10 days ago

        If you shoot down a missle it shouldn’t explode on impact and cause massive building damage like we are seeing in the photos. The largest thing you should see is like a street sign sticking into a building wall. It’s more likely the missiles missed if we are giving credit, but I doubt it. We’ll see when 3 days of this shit ends and what targets ended up being hit

        • torrentialgrain@lemm.ee
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          10 days ago

          Eh not necessarily tbh, we see that in Ukraine daily - debris of shot down rockets and drones doing substantial damage to whatever is below.

      • supersquirrel@sopuli.xyz
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        9 days ago

        If a missile, ballistic or otherwise, is intercepted no the missile will not simply be diverted it will be compromised by the interceptor.

        The more complex the warhead the more likelihood an interception will neutralize it.

        Even a JDAM or other simple bomb if it is intercepted in the air, is now set upon a path where the explosive potential is dismantled and exploited over time… in a great rushing of empty air… not a single, mighty bang at the instant the warhead touches the roof of a school or home.

        The most extreme example is a nuclear bomb, which is usually treated in pop culture as a type of bomb you have to be VERY careful not to bump into too hard… but that actually totally misunderstands the terror of a nuclear bomb, the detonation sequence of a nuclear bomb has to go off like a finely tuned wristwratch starting up, something smashing into a nuclear bomb with great velocity and momentum will simply dismantle the wristwratch into possibly radioactive pieces, but they are harmless relative to the careful orchestrated opening to a show that was thankfully permanently cancelled by the interception.

      • kreskin@lemmy.world
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        10 days ago

        No. When a military attacks a civilian structure like that they have to prove they acted proportionally, and that they acted to minimize casualties of innocents. Israel never provides that proof and they do this all the time, so absent that poof they are legally war crimes. Its well established law. There is no “of a sort” – theres war crimes and not war crimes. Israel commits war crimes and this was yet another war crime. They cant just pretend any amount of dead civilians near a “target” is just fine. Thats not how any of this works. It’d be the same war crime if they blew up a stadium full of people to kill one man.

        • Samskara@sh.itjust.works
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          10 days ago

          They don’t need to publish proof according to international law and it’s uncommon for any country to provide that. Operational security usually precludes that anyway. Proof and such come into play in a trial or Knesset parliamentary inquiry. Both of which have brought clarity in the past on Israeli action.

          Proportionality assessment is done by IDF officers and lawyers. They want their asses covered, because war crimes are also crimes under Israeli law and they want to continue traveling abroad. Proportionality is always judged by if the action is conducive to reach the military objective, while at the same time minimizing civilian casualties and damages. Zero civilian casualties is not required according to international humanitarian law.

          Anything Israel does is immediately labeled a war crime by some parties, regardless of what’s actually going on.

          It’d be the same war crime if they blew up a stadium full of people to kill one man.

          That would only be proportional under special circumstances, like if that man was extremely important, time was critical, and there was no other feasible way to target and get him. If that one man is a combatant and legitimate military target, he is also committing a war crime by hiding among civilians using them as human shields.

          So in the case of man in a stadium it would have to be literally Hitler about to launch another world war to justify blowing up the whole building. You can only get him there, because he‘s in the bunker connected to the stadium at all other times. In that case the stadium would also be filled with high ranking officers and party officials, but you said only one man. If you have a precision guided missile able to blow up only the VIP lodge, that would change the proportionality assessment of course. Proportionality depends on the objective.

          Israel‘s attacks on the apartment buildings only took out specific apartments, not destroy the whole building. This can be seen on footage from Iranian tv.

          So no, it’s not the same war crime, if it’s even a war crime.

  • Saleh@feddit.org
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    10 days ago

    Great. Israel proves once again that Iran needs a nuke to protect itself. Iran now has all the reason to quickly develop a nuke, which Israel will take as a pretext to demand the US to invade Iran for them.

    An Iranian nuke will make Saudi want one, and then Turkiye will also want one.

    Israel is doing everything it can to keep the region in perpetual war, justifying its imperialist and genocidal regime as “self defense”.

  • PixelTron@lemm.ee
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    11 days ago

    Funny how the US diverted 20k drones from Ukraine to the Middle East recently, wonder where they will end up…

    • PlutoniumAcid@lemmy.world
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      10 days ago

      And funny how the US embassy there was emptied a few days ago, citing “tensions in the region.” Almost looks like they knew, doesn’t it?

      • YTG123@sopuli.xyz
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        10 days ago

        They did know… it has been explicitly stated that they did. They’re just saying that they don’t take part in it.

        • Mrkawfee@lemmy.world
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          10 days ago

          Which is also bullshit. At the very least they provided refuelling and intelligence.

          • FelixCress@lemmy.world
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            10 days ago

            They definitely did provide support, what they are saying is that they had no say in Israel decision making process. I can believe that, Netanyahu is a fucking psychopath.

    • 52fighters@lemmy.sdf.org
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      11 days ago

      Presumably it is to discourage Iran from attacking US assets in the region, knowing that the US have weapons that they can use to counter-attack. Any counter-attack needs to be against Israel alone, not the US. That’s what the US wants.

  • acargitz@lemmy.ca
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    11 days ago

    OK, I get that Israel has the right to exist but for fucking once can it please just exist for 5 fucking minutes?

    • JustAnotherPodunk@lemmy.world
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      11 days ago

      Ever heard the saying, “spare the rod, spoil the child”?

      This is what happens. Your kid turns into a fuckin bully that punches above his weight because his dad is a cop and no one wants to stand up to him.

      And now he’s brought a Glock to school.

      • RedditcanFitself@lemmy.world
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        10 days ago

        When your kid start installing his agents in the very foundation of western countries to ensure no one oppose him for when he start murdering innocents and raging wars, please just shoot him in the face and rid the world of him.

        • JustAnotherPodunk@lemmy.world
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          10 days ago

          Oh the story of Israel’s nonsense over the past 60 plus years is so messed up. I made the comparison in jest, but it’s crazy.

          They really are the worst ride or die ally of all time. And the geopolitical math hasn’t made any sense since the cold war ended. Unless you have a secret religious need for the end of days.

        • torrentialgrain@lemm.ee
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          10 days ago

          I don’t see how Israel can lose this war, they are miles ahead in terms of military technology thanks to the US and parts of Europe and if anything goes seriously wrong they will be bailed out by a US invasion force.

          • Jakeroxs@sh.itjust.works
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            10 days ago

            “Israel won’t drag us into a war with Iran, but if they do we’ll go willingly!” - Trump within the last like two weeks

          • supersquirrel@sopuli.xyz
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            7 days ago

            All of these assumptions are not assured.

            The IDF has a very advanced military in terms of hardware, but the only doctrine they appear to practice is genocide against an enclosed much weaker enemy, which among other attrocities is an awful, counter-productive way to keep a military trained enough to function.

            Israel has more of a hyper militarized police force than a military at this point, and the consequences will be severe if Israel is successful in trying to start a regional war… as police are in my estimation are by far the most enthusiastically wrong demographic of people who think they are good at war without having ever actually experienced it (rather they have experienced the mental rush of having lethal power over others… which is not the experience of war at least beyond the first 5 minutes)…

            • kreskin@lemmy.world
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              9 days ago

              yeah, agreed. I hate to say it, but maybe the worlds only hope here is that the US is as fickle in its support of zionism as it is in every other middle eastern alliance it enters in.
              Hopefully Trump will be distracted by some mcdonalds production glitch or a burning need to nuke antarctica so he can mine some mineral he needs for syphillis medicine. Thats about our only hope. The dems are warming up a list of nothing but zionists to run for the next election, so theres no hope anytime soon otherwise. No word yet on giant meteor, but climate change is coming on fast so maybe we dont need meteor. I still have #hope.

            • torrentialgrain@lemm.ee
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              9 days ago

              They have by far the strongest and most advanced airforce in the Middle East. Nobody else there is flying F35s

          • superniceperson@sh.itjust.works
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            10 days ago

            The us isn’t invincible and Iran has shown that the iron dome can be cheaply over powered. Ukraine showed military technology isn’t that important on modern battle fields, and I doubt Israel is really prepared for a 10+ front war. The us isnt.

      • Saleh@feddit.org
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        10 days ago

        Yeah, best way to do that is always attack your neighbors.

  • N0t_5ure@lemmy.world
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    11 days ago

    Not to diminish the other grave consequences of this strike, but because of Trump’s tariffs and other erratic behavior, the U.S. economy is teetering on the edge of recession. This strike has already caused oil prices to jump significantly, which will almost certainly speed the onset and deepen the depth of the coming recession.

  • Phoenixz@lemmy.ca
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    10 days ago

    No US involvement

    Beyond the billions upon billions in weapons and sales that we’ve sent them, and keep sending them, of course

    • FEIN@lemmy.world
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      9 days ago

      I’ve heard enough, let’s send 3 trillion dollars to Israel to help them fight the oppression they’re facing 😞😞😞

  • homura1650@lemm.ee
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    11 days ago

    “Following the pre-emptive strike by the State of Israel against Iran, a missile and UAV (drone) attack against the State of Israel and its civilian population is expected in the immediate time frame,” Defence Minister Israel Katz said in a statement.

    Amazing how Israel was able to figure out when the unprovoked Iranian attack was going to occur that they managed to get their preemptive strike done in the nick of time.

    /s

  • acargitz@lemmy.ca
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    10 days ago

    Israel’s war with fucking everyone around it, is like the bullshit wars South Africa fought with all its neighbours.

    This Apartheid regime, like that Apartheid regime needs to end. It needs to be crushed and reformed.

    When Barghouti is the president of the post-Apartheid State of Israel and Palestine, we can start having peace. You may say I’m a dreamer, but I’m not the only one etc etc etc.