• twisterpop3@lemmy.world
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    19 days ago

    Why have we stopped talking about how the $15 TPU can make upgrading older systems possible? Does that not work anymore?

    • 2pt_perversion@lemmy.world
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      19 days ago

      I think they also prevent most CPU released before 2017ish from installing as well so computers just missing the proper TPM are few and far between anyway. You can still get around all the requirements pretty easily though.

      • sugar_in_your_tea@sh.itjust.works
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        19 days ago

        My Ryzen 1700 system was prevented from upgrading and it met the TPM requirement, it just wasn’t whitelisted. That CPU was released in 2017, and that whole gen was pretty popular (1600 sold like hotcakes). I think anything newer should work though.

        That said, my primary OS is Linux anyway, so it doesn’t matter, this is just an install on my other disk in case I need something Windows-specific (haven’t needed it in years).

        • VindictiveJudge@lemmy.world
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          19 days ago

          I think anything newer should work though.

          I’ve got a Ryzen 3700X and my computer told me it couldn’t do the upgrade, either.

          • sugar_in_your_tea@sh.itjust.works
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            19 days ago

            Dang. Is your board in the 300-series? Maybe it’s that?

            I haven’t checked, but I think my 5600 is compatible. Maybe I’ll check sometime, but I’m not looking forward to the mountain of patches I’ll need just by booting into it again.

  • a9249@lemmy.ca
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    19 days ago

    I know everyone here foams over Linux, and for good reason… but please remember the average user is a techno-fobe who struggles to find the start menu. Linux just isn’t an option for a lot of people. Windows has been around so long and feels familiar. Until there is a major demographic shift and ECE training on general computer use an basic troubleshooting… the majority of the population will stick with whatever arrives when they turn it on because “It’s what they know”.

    If Linux is to take over it must come PRE-installed, Must be fully compatible (read: plug-n-play); even with the weird printer your aunt found in a garage sale, at-least feel familiar to the majority of users… and for corpos… run MS office (read: excel) natively.

    • aesthelete@lemmy.world
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      19 days ago

      If Linux is to take over it must come PRE-installed, Must be fully compatible (read: plug-n-play); even with the weird printer your aunt found in a garage sale, at-least feel familiar to the majority of users… and for corpos… run MS office (read: excel) natively.

      Or we could just not care if it “takes over”?

      Even if Linux was and did all of those things – and many of them are already crossed off of the list – it may not “take over” and despite some corporate spend from some of the backing corporations, it’s not really a profit driven ecosystem. Linux doesn’t have to take over and do exactly what Microsoft does, Linux is just fine as is.

    • Ilovethebomb@lemm.ee
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      19 days ago

      Yeah, you’re right. Also, how bad Windows 11 is is massively exaggerated, once my machine was set up, all I’ve done is remove a few programs like One Drive from loading on start, and it’s been fine.

      I do need to figure out how to get rid of the news and weather thingy on the start menu, to be fair.

    • bitwolf@sh.itjust.works
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      19 days ago

      The more of us that buy computers with it preinstalled the more it signals that there is interest.

      Popular brands offer it. I’m not saying you have to go buy, but you can also let people know it’s an option.

      I bought an XPS Developer edition and when asked I explained that when Linux had support from the manufacturer it can be as reliable as their Macs, often even more reliable.

  • GreenKnight23@lemmy.world
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    19 days ago

    Yay!

    blessing in disguise. at least you can build a system so poorly that 10 won’t be forcefully upgraded on you.

  • 800XL@lemmy.world
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    19 days ago

    I bet it’ll still try to install itself on that hardware though and break it.

    • CaptKoala@lemmy.ml
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      18 days ago

      Probably how they’ll force upgrade down the track, upgrade or we brick your shit.

  • Hadriscus@lemm.ee
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    19 days ago

    I installed Linux Mint on my wife’s ageing Thinkpad (2016, new battery is en route but everything else works fine). Windows would struggle to even start its own file explorer (lol), so I said no more of that bullshit.

    She is happy with it, apart from ProNote not working (she uses the web client instead).

  • qyron@sopuli.xyz
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    19 days ago

    The used market is going to bomb if older machines can’t be setup with newer windows version.

    • adarza@lemmy.ca
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      19 days ago

      ‘incompatible’ hardware will be dirt cheap, and 8th gen or newer will sell for more than it would have otherwise–especially if tariffs jack prices up on new hardware.

      i have a couple dozen older systems here. most were given to me before win11’s requirements were known. fixing and flipping them for a few bucks was a small but relatively steady income stream, but not anymore. hardly anyone wants them.

      the couple that are new enough to be blessed by microsoft will be kept, and i’ll hang on to the better ones of the rest (like skylake, kaby lake) to put linux on. everything else will end up at ewaste recyclers even though there’s absolutely nothing wrong with any of them other than the fact that a profit and ‘shareholder value’ driven megacorp says they can’t be used anymore.

      • qyron@sopuli.xyz
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        19 days ago

        Maybe the tariffs will serve to cull a bit of the consumist impulse the US suffers of.

        Regarding if a machine is desirable or not: I’m still seeing Windows XP machines being sold today for over 100€. No monitor, no peripherals, no nothing: just the machine. And people needing a machine to type a report, do a spreadsheet, do basic office work, with no other option, pay for it.

        i run my machines until they stop working, period.

  • MonkderVierte@lemmy.ml
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    19 days ago

    What i wonder, is:

    • TPM a black box and then, why should i trust it
    • if not, why not just use RAM as protected memory instead?
  • Treczoks@lemmy.world
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    19 days ago

    They don’t need the hardware to run an OS. They need the hardware to run their AI shit for reasons nobody ever needs - except Microsoft.

    So maybe it is not Microsoft closing the door for older hardware, but older hardware closing the door for Windows 11?

    • tal@lemmy.today
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      19 days ago

      They need the hardware to run their AI shit

      The requirement is for TPM, not parallel processing hardware. It provides trusted hardware, facilitates things like DRM.

      • Treczoks@lemmy.world
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        19 days ago

        There are tons of low and medium boards that provide TPM, and they don’t suffice, IIRC.

        • tal@lemmy.today
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          19 days ago

          Did you read the article text? It’s specifically discussing how Microsoft will not relax the requirement for TPM 2.0.

          • Treczoks@lemmy.world
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            19 days ago

            Which is on the market for more than six years now. That was my point. It does not only need TPM2.0, it also needs CPU and RAM in regions that are way more recent than TPM2.0

            • Railcar8095@lemm.ee
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              19 days ago

              The CPU is due to instruction set requirements. The first version of W11 is technically compatible (with hack to pass the checks) with older CPUs than the newer versions. And it’s not Gusty’s guaranteed that there ones that currently can run it will do it after a few updates.

              I hate it, and they could have done things to allow more compatibility, but it’s not without a technical reason.

            • tal@lemmy.today
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              19 days ago

              I feel that this is diverging from your original comment, but okay, Windows 11 – as with all prior releases of Windows – has minimum CPU and memory requirements. That isn’t what the article text is discussing, but fair enough.

              But I don’t see any association with that and AI. This isn’t parallel processing hardware being discussed.

  • dmtalon@infosec.pub
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    19 days ago

    My dad’s bringing his PC to my house when they visit for Christmas so we can setup Linux as a dual boot for him to see if he can switch from Windows 10 to Linux instead of buying a new PC

    • floofloof@lemmy.ca
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      19 days ago

      My dad (in his mid 80s) told me proudly that he had just bought Linux and installed it on his computer. It’s great that he wanted to try Linux but I wonder what malware-riddled scam distro he found, and how I’ll sort it out on my next visit.

      • 3laws@lemmy.world
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        19 days ago

        Can’t be that bad. Some distros accept donations. It just could be that he felt he was making a purchase rather than just a donation.

          • Ænima@lemm.ee
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            18 days ago

            Come back and let us know what you find out, please. If it’s a malicious distro, let us know the site so we can warn others.

      • superkret@feddit.org
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        19 days ago

        Not sure if it was Mint or Ubuntu, but one of them shows a donation box with a default amount when you click download. It’s already downloading when the box shows up, but maybe he misinterpreted that.

      • Something Burger 🍔@jlai.lu
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        19 days ago

        Maybe elementaryOS? There is a Purchase button on the site, with a pay-what-you-want option. If possible to enter 0 though.

      • doctortofu@reddthat.com
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        19 days ago

        Zorin has a pro tier that costs money but it’s supposed to have the look and feel of classic Windows - maybe it’s that?

      • Sabata@ani.social
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        19 days ago

        I gave my distro dev $20 for the bragging rights. More than I ever paid for Windows.

    • corsicanguppy@lemmy.ca
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      19 days ago

      I think my retiree parents (and in-laws) are going the same way. They only use their computer for email and search, and the options are just better.

      • sugar_in_your_tea@sh.itjust.works
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        19 days ago

        I’ll have to ask my parents about it. They mostly just use a web browser, but they also occasionally use Word for writing Christmas letters and whatnot. I could probably get them to switch to LibreOffice, Google Drive, or Office365, but not completely sure about that. They are interested in getting a Chromebook, so I guess we’ll see what they end up needing.

        I try not to force Linux on anyone, but I have brought it up before as a suggestion (they were complaining about their computer being slow, and ended up buying a new one). My dad really likes Windows, but they really don’t use anything Windows-specific other than Word anymore.

  • redfellow@sopuli.xyz
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    18 days ago

    Fyi you can install it without TPM 2 hardware, if using Rufus to create the installer, you can just tick an option to remove tpm forcing.

    That’s if you want to keep using Windows after 2025 on a 7+ year old hardware.

    Not endorsing it, just saying you can, at no extra cost.

    • reksas@sopuli.xyz
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      18 days ago

      if you want to risk random update potentially bricking your computer or at least your os breaking, not worth it

    • rumba@lemmy.zip
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      18 days ago

      That’ll work until they actually make it do something with the TPM.

      I bet in 3 years they’ll require an AI accelerator.

      • redfellow@sopuli.xyz
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        18 days ago

        As far as I’m aware TPM 2 pretty much does with hardware, what is otherwise software emulated. It’s more efficient and secure when using something like bitlocker etc. Everything should work, just is more suspectible to tampering and malware.

  • Dead_or_Alive@lemmy.world
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    19 days ago

    Thank you Microsoft after being a windows user since the 3.1 days your recent changes to Windows makes me happy to announce I bought my first MAC.

  • Lippy@fedia.io
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    19 days ago

    That’s fine, I’ve closed the door on supporting Microsoft. They could have just charged for the ‘upgrade’ and that would have been better since it wouldn’t result in the colossal amount of e-waste that this is creating. Even without the forced obsolescence, their products have become hostile, invasive and generally just a PITA to use. Meanwhile Linux distros are knocking it out of the park lately.

    I really don’t know what Microsoft are thinking. They haven’t made particularly good strides towards gaining any kind of goodwill, so once it becomes common knowledge that alternatives not only exist but actually show them up, those lost customers are people that they will never get back. Look how pathetic their marketshare is for Edge for example, even though it’s the default browser on Windows. They still haven’t been able to shake off the bad stigma that Internet Explorer had (and to be fair, they aren’t doing people any favours with Edge either).

    • Flocklesscrow@lemm.ee
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      18 days ago

      The new Outlook is fucking awful.

      How did they fuck up email? Just put them all on the left and let me read and move them in the fewest clicks possible.

      • notthebees@reddthat.com
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        18 days ago

        also trying to add more emails to outlook. How do you fuck that up. You only get the options for suggested emails or new email creation.