For context: I habe a PC with an 8gb SSD and I somehow need to get an app on there that only has a flatpak release

  • x00z@lemmy.worldEnglish
    1043·
    3 months ago

    Flatpak seems to be the best choice for consistency and to have it working straight out of the box. I think Linux currently needs this because we’re getting a lot less tech-savvy Linux users nowadays. Don’t get me wrong; package managers should still be used, but how are we going to get people to change if they run into package conflicts or accidentally uninstall a wrong package?

    • ZkhqrD5o@lemmy.world
      321·
      3 months ago

      And universal compatability. One repo, for all distros. That’s a big plus too!

        • ZkhqrD5o@lemmy.world
          15·
          3 months ago

          Well, that’s the neat part. We don’t need to do that because what Flatpak does, doesn’t matter for them. People can just install Flatpak in their system and they have access to everything. I realise for system components it’s a different story, but that’s not the use case, it’s for applications.

          Edit: typo.

    • Cethin@lemmy.zipEnglish
      41·
      3 months ago

      It’s useful, but it isn’t the best option for everyone, so other options should be available.

      • lastweakness@lemm.ee
        1·
        3 months ago

        Why would you want the app devs to make that? The whole problem with distro-specific packages is having to package for multiple formats and it’s a painstaking process that really isn’t worth any amount of time investment at all. If you’re an app developer, you’d much rather just make a universal package and hope that some distro package maintainer packages your app for their distro. That’s just basic common sense…

        • Cethin@lemmy.zipEnglish
          1·
          3 months ago

          Because Flatpaks can’t share libraries or anything. It creates a lot of bloat that doesn’t need to be there. It’s great for users that want to make sure the app will always work, but it isn’t great for being efficient.

          • lastweakness@lemm.ee
            1·
            3 months ago

            This is just a straight up lie. Flatpaks do share libraries, both as runtimes (as seen even in the screenshot here) and through deduplication between different runtimes and runtime versions. There’s usually very little bloat, if any, especially if you use Flatpaks a lot, which you probably should, given the huge number of advantages especially with proprietary apps.

    • tazeycrazy@feddit.ukEnglish
      2·
      3 months ago

      I just what to install an app. I don’t want to spend an evening figgering out how to get a PWA to install. I don’t want to consult a form or your git repository to install some package I will use once and will be patched out in the next version.

  • PanArab@lemm.ee
    551·
    3 months ago

    8GB SSD

    There’s your problem. The last time 8GB was plenty was in 1998.

    • Aux@feddit.ukEnglish
      9·
      3 months ago

      Even cheap SD cards are larger these days. The smallest SSD you can buy in the UK right now is 250GB.

    • NekuSoul@lemmy.nekusoul.de
      81·
      3 months ago

      Yup. Those 64 GB SSDs many retailers put into cheap laptops already come dangerously close to violating the Geneva Convention. 8GB is just stupid, even for a Linux system.

      • udon@lemmy.world
        51·
        3 months ago

        Reading through the comments here, the Linux community slowly seems move away from “runs on about every piece of hardware you can think of” to “if you don’t have at least the Nimbus 2000 that’s on you, sucker!”

        • milicent_bystandr@lemm.ee
          2·
          3 months ago

          Gotta run FFMMLXIV at 94fps and 173hz @3890x2669 resolution otherwise you’re betraying the “Linux is the best gaming OS” movement we’ve all sworn fealty to.

        • rice@lemmy.orgEnglish
          2·
          3 months ago

          don’t wanna be mean to any demographic but it’s literally the windows gamer converts. Not all of them though. At the same time that kills the other linux elites of “you don’t compile gentoo from scratch on every system?” so…

    • rice@lemmy.orgEnglish
      1·
      3 months ago

      oh wow that’s way worse than the crappy one he said in his actual post… He said a totally different software. He’s trying to run several things on this machine lol

  • macniel@feddit.org
    39·
    3 months ago

    did you see those little < in front of the download sizes? org.kde.KStyle.Adwaita, org.kdePlatform.Locale, org.kde.Platform and com.ktechpit.torrhunt won’t be fully downloaded as those are possibly already installed and can be reused, so in the best case you only download org.freedesktop.Platform.GL.nvidia-570-86-16 fully.

    • lastweakness@lemm.ee
      2·
      3 months ago

      There’s also deduplication across the different files. So you could even end up with less overall size over time if you use Flatpaks for everything.

  • superkret@feddit.org
    32·
    3 months ago

    I habe a PC with an 8gb SSD

    Are you using a first gen eeePC?
    I think I bought one of those for 40€, 12 years ago.

  • gamer@lemm.ee
    313·
    3 months ago

    Flatpaks implement deduping, so they actually don’t take that much space when installed.

    I habe a PC with an 8gb SSD

    I think I found your real problem.

  • Grass@sh.itjust.works
    26·
    3 months ago

    its barely legible but isnt that still less than a gb? where you you even get an 8gb ssd? why would you use one outside of some specialized embedded application that shouldn’t even have a desktop interface? and even then why not something lighter than kde or gnome

    • Luffy@lemmy.mlOP
      141·
      3 months ago

      where you you even get an 8gb ssd

      I bought a Fujitsu thin client for 30€, and I decided to spend the 5€ extra to get one with a drive (making it 30€ total.

      why would you use one outside of some specialized embedded application that shouldn’t even have a desktop interface?

      1. I have way too much free time

      2. I have no money

      3. Originally it should only have been a minimal void Linux install so it can connect to my local server via RDP. But I just realised that that futro s920 with 4 1,5ghz cores is actually way faster and more reliable than my 4th gen Intel i5 will ever be

      and even then why not something lighter than kde or gnome

      I ssh’d into the PC. It runs xfce4, and it is just made to display shortwave (an Internet radio player) in full screen on a cashier terminal screen that I ripped from the terminal assembly. I just needed the cheapest thing to run shortwave on so my father has an Internet radio, since the other 2 options were

      • buy a big ass Antenna for his normal radio, or

      • buy a used Internet radio for 200€ (this way it only cost about 90€), wait until its Server is shut down, and then somehow with a mix of wireshark, dns logging, and pure luck somehow locally rerout the domain that the radio tries to connects to, figure out what kind of json file I need to host on my local server in order to make it refresh it’s database of Radios, and maintain these IPs forever.

      also, please note, the image is in no way connected to this project, it just reminded me of it

      • smeg@feddit.ukEnglish
        11·
        3 months ago

        Maybe get the cheapest micro sd card or usb drive you can find and install it on there? You could probably double your storage size for a couple of euros!

  • pH3ra@lemmy.ml
    282·
    3 months ago

    Yeah flatpak won’t work on my Nokia 3310 either, what a shit software…

    Edit: if you upvoted this comment, your kneecaps pop when you pick up things from the ground

    • Smee@poeng.link
      2·
      3 months ago

      I’m too old to pick up stuff from the ground, I use one of them claws on a stick. Also, the 3210 was a nice phone while the 3310 was for the hip kids.

    • Luffy@lemmy.mlOP
      14·
      3 months ago

      Sort of, actually

      I was trying to build a PC just to play internet radio on using Shortwave, and a 30€ thin client with 4 1,5Ghz cores and no active cooling, 4 gigs of ram and an 8gb ssd were more than enough for that

      • uuldika@lemmy.ml
        2·
        3 months ago

        look into NixOS! there might already be a package for it. and NixOS can be very good about not duplicating dependencies.

        • Euphoma@lemmy.mlEnglish
          2·
          3 months ago

          I had a 200 gb ssd on my laptop and kept running out of space because all the old generations from nixos,

          • uuldika@lemmy.ml
            1·
            3 months ago

            nix collect-garbage, comrade! there’s also another command to clean up older generations. if you’re using git to version your nix config, you only really need to keep two generations: the current, and your last successful boot, since you can recover by git checkout.

      • rice@lemmy.orgEnglish
        1·
        3 months ago

        this? https://gitlab.gnome.org/World/Shortwave

        I think on a system like that you shouldn’t even run a GUI or a window manager at most. What is the service that is actually using though, it links to this https://www.radio-browser.info/ I guess I see you can play stations directly from that. It seems it makes more sense to use like lynx browser or something to just browse that website directly.

        I’ve clicked like 10 of them they are all mp3 or aac. mpv or vlc can decode those on the command line and play it with using like 15-100mb of space on your storage. Like this random station for example https://stream-uk1.radioparadise.com/aac-320

        all in all your total install should be like 400mb

        • Luffy@lemmy.mlOP
          1·
          3 months ago

          It is not for me personally, but for a person who wants a gui. And a Touch screen. Also I need an on Screen Keyboard because he also does not want to use a keyboard or mouse.

          I tried using a very simple compositor like cage to just start shortwave, but I couldnt get my Keyboard to work since it needs gnome accessibility runtime to automatically show when clicking a text field.

          And also xfce is more than light enough not to take up more than 1-2 secs of the total boot time

          The flatpak thing was just the jellyfin-media-player so I can play my music from jellyfin too, but I guess ill just set up DLNA so I can stream to the device from my Phone

  • boredsquirrel@slrpnk.net
    22·
    3 months ago

    Yes absolutely true, but also no.

    https://gitlab.com/TheEvilSkeleton/flatpak-dedup-checker

    For me it is 32GB of data with deduplication, and only like 25GB with BTRFS compression.

    So while still way too much, not really a problem if you have a reasonable 50mbits+ internet connection and a 200GB+ SSD

    There should still be waay more force. There should only be one runtime (FDO) and KDE and GNOME being extensions to that. Not sure if these perfectly dedupe though

  • krull_krull@lemmy.dbzer0.com
    201·
    3 months ago

    “maybe a software being excessively bloated isn’t a good thing”

    “just buy more storage bro”

    B*tch. i live in a third world country, with limited internet and data plan, and also is still a student. If i can just buy more storage and better hardware i will.

  • pixeltree@lemmy.blahaj.zone
    192·
    3 months ago

    Lol kinda wild to me seeing flatpak hate as a new Linux user (running fedora with kids). Flatpaks have just worked for me and it’s been fantastic

    • gamer@lemm.ee
      111·
      3 months ago

      If you’re new to Linux, then your probably not familiar with the full Linux community yet. Much like in real life, online Linux spaces tend to have a very loud minority of conservatives who hate progress.

      Usually you’ll see them hating on things like systemd, 64bit architectures, containers, new packaging systems (like Flatpak), immutable and experimental distros (like Nix), Wayland, “bloated” desktops like KDE or Gnome, and much more.

      And just like in real life, the antidote is to not take another person’s word for it. Do your own homework/try things out yourself and arrive at your own conclusions.

    • rice@lemmy.orgEnglish
      1·
      3 months ago

      whoa look at mr rich boy here with a drive that costs more than $2 on ebay

    • Sauerkraut@discuss.tchncs.de
      1·
      3 months ago

      Flatpaks work great on my laptop, but they have can have issues if you use multiple hard-drives or partitions. Especially for gaming.

    • Luffy@lemmy.mlOP
      42·
      3 months ago

      Yes, I personally use flatpak because I want a reliable way to update packages that are not in the native repositories. Still, I would love if it would be like snaps in the sense that I can use the native libraries and only install the app as flatpak.

      Its just really frustrating to have to install the whole fricking gnome desktop again just so some flatpak can use it

      • rice@lemmy.orgEnglish
        1·
        3 months ago

        damn you got ubuntuwashed, not sure if that is worse than windowashed or not