likely in response to my comments on the beehaw post, which i linked to (hopefully im doing this right?). apparently, calling people you dont know for the first time “they/them” before being told their pronouns is “misgendering”. absurd. this kind of attitude threatens the larger LGBTQ community and is partially why cishets hate us after we won so much progress back in the 00s and 10s.
im a queer person. im neurodivergent. this shit is so goddamn fucking annoying, especially as an older queer who got physically assaulted on a near daily basis for being queer in the 90s. the kids today get their panties in a twist over being supposedly “misgendered” by someone calling them gender neutral pronouns before being corrected. narcissistic victimhood bullshit.
anyways, now banned from one of my favorite instances. meanwhile in the US theyre planning on hunting us. but yeah, lets ban fellow queers over their view that people who get mad about being “misgendered” when they arent (cis people are also referred to as “they/them” before further context in a conversation with a stranger) are just attention seeking brats that threaten the larger movement. its so obvious to me that the brats who find reason to be offended over innocent pronoun use never faced real adversity, like getting repeatedly physically beaten.
edit - the best part of all of this is i faced no moderation from beehaw and all of my comments are +1 or higher. power tripping oversensitive neurodivergent hating bastard of a mod over at blahaj IMO.
edit 2 - did this wrong. heres a link to the post i think got me banned from blahaj and a screenshot about it https://lemmy.dbzer0.com/post/37659465
Edit 3 - apparently I did nothing wrong until I made my thoughts known about how the pronoun police fucked over the larger LGBTQ community as our rights are backsliding in America. Yall are gonna whine about being misgendered to the concentration camp guards at the rate we’re going. God forbid I be angry that while queers were busy fighting over pronouns our adversaries stuffed the courts, stuffed the school boards, couped the government, and are installing a fascist dictatorship. When I say that these fucking toddlers are going to learn what real oppression tastes like, that’s what I mean. It’s not that I want us to be hurt or oppressed (as the dog piling idiots have interpreted), it’s that the younger generation is weak as hell and lost the fucking plot in the fight for our rights. I grew up getting beaten in the streets for being queer only for these kids to claim their pronouns not being mind-read is oppression!
OP has revealed their true colours in their comments in the threads here. Fucking LGB alliance bullshit. If you wanna divide the queer community like this you are absolutely gatekeeping at best and straight up transphobic in all likelihood. I on the other hand will continue to love and support every single facet of the 2SLGBTQIA+ spectrum without calling something I don’t experience or understand “attention seeking brats”.
“Never faced real adversity” Jesus Christ fuck you. If being denied the opportunity to marry officially is adversity then being denied your EXISTENCE officially is also fucking adversity. This is textbook gate keeping and ladder pulling. You fought for gay/lesbian/bisexual rights and you got somewhere with it and now that transgender and genderqueer people who don’t have their rights are asking for support you call them whiny piss babies.
I’m trying my absolute best to bee nice as per my instance, but no. From the bottom of my autistic, transgender, lesbian heart - fuck you.
And here’s the kicker. I could not be more opposed to you right now. BUT I will still fight for you and accept you as part of the queer community.
Stop trying to hide behind your queerness or neurodivergence and take ownership of your bigotry and try to address it.
Do not bother replying to me, OP,
I will not read it.But I hope you grow.YDI
LOL YOU THINK THIS IS ABOUT GAY MARRIAGE?
No you dumb fuck, I used to be BEAT IN THE FUCKING STREET FOR 15 FUCKING YEARS OF MY LIFE.
Hearing whiny fucks bitch and moan about how oppressed they are because somebody called them a they/them instead of he/him or she/her is fucking INFURIATING.
And y’all don’t want to admit that the pronoun bullshit is why we’ve lost so much of what we gained. Y’all don’t want to admit that being whiny fucks made y’all lose the plot.
So now we’re all at risk, from the bottom of my autistic lesbian heart, fuck all the people who got hung up on pronouns instead of fighting the real fucking fights. Pronouns in your bio and rainbows in the street and corporate rainbow washing didn’t do fucking shit for any of us but the kids bought it hook line and sinker.
While queers were whining about their pronouns the federalist society took over our courts. While queers were whining about their pronouns our country got couped. Queers are gonna be whining about their pronouns all the way to the concentration camp guards.
God you’re insufferable. Fine I’ll bite.
I used gay marriage as a way to help you see similarities.
Answer me one question, real quick: do you think transgender and genderqueer people are oppressed?
Damn, this is a trip
This is both PTB and YDI.
The blanket bans on a different instance is definitely overkill, which points right to a power trip. If it had been one or two, maybe it could be dismissed, but that many? Nah, that’s fucking crazy.
But you were being a dick all up and down that thread.
Now, I want you to stop for a second. See what I just said? What are you thinking and feeling right this second, after reading it.
Go back to the thread you linked. Reread what you wrote with whatever reaction you had to me saying you were being a dick in your mind. See all those places where you were projecting that anyone that might object to your pronoun usage were being lesser because of it? Yeah, you were essentially just saying they would be dicks, and that you were better than them.
Now, it doesn’t really matter whether point has any validity. It could have been relevant, but you were ranting all throughout the thread. When someone does that, they have to understand that it could come with consequences. That the consequences were far out of line is a separate issue.
Now, fwiw, I actually partially agree with your premise, though the way you express it, and the details of your reasoning behind it are not good. Particularly the part about why “cishets hate us”. I get why you might think that, but it simply doesn’t match the words and actions of the bigots.
Basically, you took a pet peeve, went on a rant and it was tangential to the actual post. I’m surprised the ban wasn’t from beehaw, they tend to frown on that degree of venom from anyone.
But, again, despite you deserving something for running around foaming at the mouth digitally, the blanket bans are way out of line too
I think this is a fair perspective to take. FWIW, Blahaj being the #1 trans-inclusive and welcoming instance, and the fact that they generally do a really good job of keeping transphobia and hate out, does make me give them some leeway. (Like, maybe OP could have just apologized? It’s not hard.)
But also, yeah, I recognize that a more traditional approach to moderation makes this look heavy-handed.
“Foaming at the mouth”
The only ones foaming at the mouth are overprivileged piss baby queers who get OfFeNdEd that they were “misgendered” by a stranger calling them “they” for the first time upon meeting. Aka USING ENGLISH THE WAY ENGLISH WORKS. Not misgendering, not deadnaming, not being intentionally offensive.
Fucking piss baby queers that have never faced any real adversity and their whiny behavior threatens us all.
As someone who was physically assaulted my entire childhood for being queer only to watch this younger generation piss away all that we fought for over fucking PRONOUNS is fucking offensive. They have zero respect for the queers who fought the real fight before them.
As a cis lesbian who’s gender nonconforming, I’ve spent years putting up with their pronoun based faux “oppression” temper tantrums out of an effort to be “accepting” only to watch larger society completely flip on us. Their “fight” makes a mockery out of what came before them. Now we’re under serious physical threat again but yeah, let’s go be pronoun police finding things to get offended by that make us feel important (main character syndrome, thanks iPad babies) rather than fight actual fucking oppression.
You misunderstood the entire post it looks like.
OP asks the question “what if I know or have been introduced to the person’s pronouns but forget?” This is visible in OP’s own admission: “I am terrible at remembering people’s pronouns.”
Someone responded with slight misunderstanding or perhaps inclarity essentially saying “if you misgender someone you might seem bigoted.”
Then instead of giving any good faith or asking for clarification, you responded with very high toxicity.
Now, I can see that you misunderstood and thought the conversation was about people you don’t know, but your response was very inappropriate and normalizing of hate, using phrases like “For fucks sake this is why the heteros hate us. Younger queers need faux outrage to feel important.” Even the beehaw mod gave you a reprimand.
That behavior and escalation of the conversation is terribly toxic and I do not blame blahaj for not giving you an in depth benefit-of-the-doubt investigation before deciding they didn’t want that behavior.
Verdict: YDI but I get how this misunderstanding happened. My suggestion:
- Reread the post and your comments.
- Acknowledge your misunderstanding and apologize to the person you were toxic to.
- Apologize and clarify the misunderstanding to blahaj.
- Work on your deescalation skills.
So. Funny. About the downvotes. Read the post, people. I’m not trying to attack, it’s literally an obvious misunderstanding that I’m trying to lend clarity to. Behold two entirely different conversations:
@schleudersturz@beehaw.org When I see people I know, I can remember who they are, what we have done together, where we have been, what we have seen and even the tone of voice they might use to exclaim at an occurrence or upon some eventuality but – yet – I often cannot remember their names. Pronouns are like parts of their names. And, so, I tend to address everyone with “they” / “them”.
@inv3r5ion@lemmy.dbzer0.com apparently, calling people you dont know for the first time “they/them” before being told their pronouns is “misgendering”.
“People you don’t know” versus “people you know”
Obvious misunderstanding. It’s all laid out for you if you open your eyes lmao.
Okay I have to ask: if you don’t know someone’s gender, but you can’t call them uh, they/them, then what in the fuck are you supposed to do exactly?
Like, I fully get doing it in person can be being a dick, but on the internet where you absolutely do not know unless someone tells you?
That’s the dumbest thing I’ve heard today, and I was on reddit earlier.
Ask for the platform to have pronouns built in.
I’m sceptical about hexbear as much as the next person, but they pronouns mandatory policy was a good one
IDK, this would force closeted trans people either to out themselves or misgender themselves. Not everyone is in a position where it’s safe to be themselves, even online.
Interesting point. But then don’t have those people to misgender themselves as well when people ask them their pronouns online?
TL;DR:
BPRCSPR (charged situation-provoked reaction). OP was gatekeeping a wee bit but this was definitively not worth a permaban, at most a “chill your head!” 1d ban. OP being queer and the issue happening outside Blåhaj are also relevant.
Sorry in advance for the WORDS, WORDS, WORDS.
Also, I’m not queer. Or an instance owner. I’m open to hear about things that I got wrong. I’m judging things here because it’s how this comm works.
I don’t disagree with the core of what you’re saying, it’s sensible stuff:
- it is completely fine to use they/them as a default; it is not misgendering
- some people overreact to what, contextually, clearly conveys “I don’t know your gender”
- queers on the verge of being hunted is way, way more serious than pronouns
100% agree with the above. But even then, check your own comment:
This attitude drives me fucking nuts as a millennial who had to fight the real fights for LGBTQ acceptance only for the younger generation to get their panties in a twist for inadvertently being called by the “wrong” (gender neutral) pronoun.
Queers are on the verge of being hunted and exterminated in the US and y’all are pissy over being called a gender neutral pronoun by someone who doesn’t know you?
For fucks sake this is why the heteros hate us. Younger queers need faux outrage to feel important. Now the real threats are back on the horizon. Thanks to young out of touch activists caring more about pronouns than our physical safety and well-being.
You’re arbitrarily drawing a line and saying “up to this point, it is not an important matter. Past that point, it is”. Well… this is gatekeeping! Cat shit might not be as serious of a problem as elephant shit, but both are still shit, you know?
Then there’s the matter of this happening outside Blåhaj. I get why the admins there ban people for activity outside their own instance: the instance is home to extremely marginalised groups, that requires getting rid of bad faith actors (haters, chasers…) even before they set their feet there.
So for example. Let’s say that I (cis, hetero) said something that can be understood as bigotry. It would be only sensible if Blahaj banned me on the spot - better safe than sorry, right?
…however that clearly does not apply to you - even if not trans you’re gender-diverse. (I always check profiles before judging people.) Blahaj is supposed to be inviting to people like you. It shifts the issue from “some cis hetero got banned by mistake” to “someone who should feel safe in that instance got banned by mistake”. Plus what you’re saying isn’t even bigoted, it’s simply gatekeeping.
Based on all of that I think that some intervention from the Blahaj admins would be sensible, even if this happened outside their “turf”, but they went a bit too far. [/two cents]
It’s not gatekeeping, and this narcissistic faux outrage over being “misgendered” is harmful to the LGBTQ community.
You’re not queer and you don’t understand the level of anger right now that American queers have. As someone who faced outright physical abuse chronically for being queer as a kid seeing permanently online baby queers get pissy over pronouns while we’re about to be hunted again is absolutely fucking rage inducing for good reason. These fucking piss babies need to get their shit together.
I really feel like the old fight is over. I openly walked hand in hand with my boyfriend in 1996 in Sydney and didn’t even get strange looks let alone shouting or hitting
Boys who acted gay in my all boys high school in the 90s did get bullied for acting gay about as much as I got bullied for having the wrong accent, so pretty bad.
I think it’s fair for the youth today to try and improve less significant issues when they feel safe, and I don’t think I have seen people told off for using they/them/themself when they don’t know someone’s pronouns because they have never met before
It’s also the trans people who are getting overt threats from the US government more so than gays, they also rely on hormone therapy and government could deny that usage, driving them to black market hormones and a lot of suicides
The uh scare quotes aren’t really helping your case. Being queer doesn’t mean you automatically understand the seriousness of other queer people’s concerns and it also doesn’t mean you’re free of bigotry.
Consider like lgbt erasure from official histories, many people scoffed at concerns like this and thought it was hysterical pearl clutching to make a big deal about whether or not someone’s sexuality was mentioned or whatever. Others will tell you it literally saved their lives knowing that people like them existed in the past.
I don’t think it’s that hard to just be kind, and if you can’t be kind be funny and then block them and move on :P
Your problem was trusting an instance to be pro-trans when they explicitly support anti-trans trolls like drag. They don’t care about the community or the effects of their rules, they just like being able to make them and have power.
YCLB
what does this stand for
you clueless bastard
me or the mod?
oh im sorry i see how that could be confusing i meant you
