Because what the US considers left (universal health care, helping the poor, school lunches and affordable education) is considered middle of the road normal stuff in Europe and other developed countries.
Even the historical, biggest right wing party in Denmark would not remove any of the things you mentioned, except school lunches.
Easy: even if you vote for Bernie that’s still at best center-left. The US just really, really leans right overall: there’s center-right (democrats) and far-right (republicans) and that’s about it.
You guys are so afraid of socialism no party dares venture the true left.
Americans being afraid of socialism is proof that propaganda works. It’s literally for the people.
As does decades of systematically defunding education. The decades of leaded gas/paint by prior generations probably weren’t helping…
Joe Biden is now the Nickelback /Big Bang Theory of Presidents.
There’s nothing really bad about him, nothing really great, but they’ve been told to hate on him, so that’s what they’ll do.
nothing really bad about him
Uh, except his racism? FFS, we can demand better.
the genocide doesnt count?
And a good chunk of our parties are now far far right.
Added bonus: it’s not just socialism that we’re afraid of. We fear tons of things now. We’ve become a nation of fear and boiling hate under the hood and it’s truly toxic.
Yes, I’ve been working to leave for a few years now. My children shouldn’t have to grow up in a culture of barely surviving, anxiety & fearful people scrabbling over scraps left to us by the ultra wealthy.
I left 6 years ago and don’t regret it for a minute.
Where did you move to?
Netherlands
Because the American left would be considered right wing in most of the world.
The Democrats would be the conservative party in my country. The Republicans would be watched by law enforcement for fascistic tendencies, or already outright illegal.
Which country?
Germany. We learned our lessons about fascism. The US didn’t, and if they don’t get their acts together, they soon will. Then may God help us all.
Didn’t the CDU dominate Germany for decades? Christian Democrats are much more socially conservative than the American Democratic party. Weird flex, not okay.
CDU is center-right.
I would not rate the German CDU as more conservative than the US Democrats, at least not significantly.
Other people have already posted good answers so I just want to add a couple things.
If you want a very simple, concrete example: Healthcare. It depends on how you count, but more than half the world’s countries have some sort of free or low cost public healthcare, whereas in the US, the richest country in the history of countries, that’s presented as radical left wing kooky unrealistic communist Bernie idea. This isn’t an example of a left-wing policy that we won’t adopt, but of what in much of the world is a normal public service that we can’t adopt because anti-socialism in this country is so malignant and metastasized that it can be weaponized against things that are just considered normal public services almost like roads in other countries.
A true left wing would support not just things like healthcare, but advocate for an economic system in which workers have control over their jobs, not the bosses. That is completely absent.
Also, this meme:
It’s glib, but it’s not wrong. Both parties routinely support American militarism abroad. Antimilitarism in favor of internationalism has been a corner stone for the left since the left began.
in my world, that’s called same shit different pile.
also,while i am no right wing supporter, i constantly run into leftist who wouldn’t hesitate to brand me a phobe of their convenience ,none of the right leaning people i interacted with does this… anecdotal i know.
“I constantly complain about anyone left of Thatcher and have reactionary social views, the people who agree with me don’t criticise me. Curious!”
that’s a strange observation,given i actually criticise both left and right rather than just the left.
Uh huh, of course.
So it’s pronouns right? that’s what’s got you worked up?
Removed by mod
You just confirmed its pronouns.
i just confirmed i don’t care about pronouns unless you want to make it so.
Because liberals are just center of right. If you go too far left things become better for workers and not the ruling shit heads.
Lol
what happens when you go far left??
my last interaction with them convinced me they aren’t any different from the alt right.
Allow me to enlighten you by illustrating how both sides are absolutely not the same
Some highlights:
There is a stark difference in the means with which the two groups engage in acts of extremism. In a study evaluating Left-Wing and Right-Wing domestic extremism between 1994 and 2020, there was one fatality as the result of Left-Wing extremism, versus 329 fatalities resulting from Far Right extremism in that 25 year period. [5]
The Far-Right movement is the oldest and most deadly form of domestic terrorism in the United States, and The Anti-Defamation League Center on Extremism found that the Far-Right is responsible for 98% of extremist murders in the U.S. [24] Furthermore, for nearly every year since 2011, Far-Right terrorist attacks/plots have accounted for over half of all terror attacks/plots in the United States. [21]
In the U.S., Right-Wing extremism was responsible for two-thirds of all failed, foiled, or successful terror attacks in 2019, and was responsible for 90% of attacks in the first half of 2020 alone. [21] Since 2013, Far-Right extremism has been responsible for more terror attacks/plots than the Left-Wing, ethnonationalism, or religiously motivated attacks/plots. [21]
These are excerpts from a blog post of mine, but I have ads turned off and do not benefit in any way from it.
so,same shit different pile??
Did you read any of that?
I did,it compared right wing extermism to left wing extremism. one had more death than the other but extremism nonetheless…hence same shit different pile.
or are you suggesting being a left wing extremist is the better option than say being in the middle ground…because death??
One death from left wing extremism in 25 years, versus 329 from the right, 32900% more. To say that this is the “same shit” is clearly absurd. We aren’t discussing the merits of the middle ground. You seem to be suggesting that just because something is labelled as “extremist” it is automatically bad, regardless of what it actually is or what harm it causes.
one extreme isn’t exactly better than the other. they are extremes and should be regarded as such.
left extremism does not represent good neither does it represent evil,same goes for right wing extremism.
what i find interesting is people seem to think left wing extremism is the ONLY way to go,ignoring the fact that left wing extremism also practice discrimination, ostracism,bigotry and racism,not that much different from right wing extremism.
Extremism is not good or bad, just like being in the middle is not good or bad either. What matters is what’s correct.
For example, between being pro-fascism and anti-fascism, anti-fascism is both extreme and correct.
sure,if that’s what you think is correct.
i am sure when you preach that being gay is God’s intention,i am sure Christians and Muslim will agree that correct.
don’t forget to label me a homophobe if that’s what it is now.
No. Completely different and entirely incompatible.
When you go far left, you have ideologies like Socialism, Communism, and Anarchism, all ideologies that oppose unjust hierarchy and advocate for the good of all.
The far-right is completely different from the far-left, because the far-right has ideologies like fascism and feudalism. This is an inherently violent, reactionary position found to uphold the status quo, ie the division of power, via absolute measures.
These are not the same.
This image from 2020 sums it up decently…
Also: you guys messed up the colors for the parties, red is for left leaning parties, blue is for right leaning. But I guess that is just the US being the US, like temperature, weight and distance units.
I guess because they switched positions a long while ago.
Wait, Reps used to be left of Dems?
For 30 years it was the same way as the UK, based on the system. It wasn’t until Gore v Dubya that the NYT printed it in colour with red being republican. The reason? Both red and republican start with R… They really knew their audience!
Because there is no party available to elect, who care for the workers/people.
You have a system that is designed to take money from the poor and lower class and give it to the rich. You don’t have proper workers rights, spend about twice the amount for healthcare compared to an European person and get substantially less out of it. People work more than 40h/week in more than one job and can’t make ends meet… There are vast rural parts that look more like a third world country. Everything is made for commerce and nobody cares for LGBT people or women unless there’s some money or publicity in it.
And you have about 2 parties who both participate and stand for that scheme.
Because all the true is gone.
There’s no leftist party, nothing Socialist in the least. The furthest “left” you go is the DNC, which is liberal, and therefore right wing. The furthest right you go is the GOP, which is fascist.
Compared to the rest of the first world countries, our farthest left candidates are relatively moderate.
A few years ago I would have agreed with this statement. But lately, I’ve seen a change described in several press articles and news pieces. The younger generations in the US demand true social justice and aren’t afraid to say they’re socialists, against capitalism or consumerism. It’s a burgeoning revolution of course, since the establishment is still in control of traditional political parties. But this crack in the old broken system could bring about positive change in the long run. At least I hope so.
@return2ozma@lemmy.world One way to think about “the left” is that it values freedom from domination. Who in the US is fighting to reduce the level of domination we experience in important areas of life (health care, education, food, housing to name a few)? Should we really have to pay and put ourselves into debt–thereby becoming dominated–to go to school, live somewhere, or maintain our health? Even the so-called left in the US supports this arrangement generally; at best they fight over the details, not the structure itself.
Examples of true left would be codeterminisn in Germany and banning tuition fees in Finland.
If one were to gather political parties from around the world and sort them as left-leaning, center, or right-leaning, one could do so. However when it came time to compare the left-leaning parties of other developed nations with the left-leaning parties of the united states, it would quickly become apparent that the “most-left” party in the united states aligns with center-right and far-right parties of other developed nations. So, doing such analysis you quickly come to realize that the united states has no true left-wing party. We have conservative and conservative-light. It should also be noted that the conservative party in the united states is much further right than most other developed nations.
Also, remember, right-left is a duopoly, much like Pepsi and Coke. There are so many more dimensions to politics than right-left, there’s a thousand different parties for every ideology. For more info on this, check out the podcast linked at the end. Support ranked choice voting if you want to take steps to end this duopoly. What do you have to lose? Entrenched life-long, un-removeable politicians. What do you have to gain? Choice. Variety. More direct democratic representation and politicians that better reflect their voter’s interests.
Freakanomics
Episode 356
America’s Hidden Duopoly
https://freakonomics.com/podcast/americas-hidden-duopoly-2/Keep it polite people. 🙂
