Still not theft.
I’m fine with people calling piracy theft, if it means they’ll pirate more.
it’s not theft it’s plundering
It’s just a better product.
Yup, if you present me a side-by-side of the free one and the paid one when the free one is better even disregarding costs, I’m pirating 100% of the time.
- “Oh, you’ll only have access to this as long as our servers remain online or as long as we keep renewing the license.”
- “Sorry, your device needs to phone home to use this.”
- “Don’t you love ads in your paid product?”
- “You’ll need to juggle several different services if you want what you can otherwise get for free on a central hub.”
- “Yes, you can only use this on one or two devices at a time thanks to DRM.”
- “Fuck you, you’ll need an account with us to use this even though you bought it without that account somewhere else.”
- “This thing’s only ongoing cost on our end is version updates you totally need and want, so it’ll be an indefinite subscription (which we’ll make a pain in the ass to cancel).”
- “This game runs noticeably worse because of the shitty DRM we shoehorned in.”
- “You’re saying you don’t like being spied on for ad targeting?”
- “You can only get this bundled with a bunch of other bullshit you don’t want and would never pay for individually.”
- “Our UI that you’re forced to interact with to use this is fucking garbage.”
- “We don’t sell this anymore; ask Scalper4478 on eBay.”
- “We use the money that you pay us to lobby against your rights as a consumer.”
- “We somehow lack QoL features that the free version has.”
You’ll need to juggle several different services if you want what you can otherwise get for free on a central hub.
This one, while common, I kind of take issue with. You’re basically complaining that there is no one, all-consuming media oligarchy that owns EVERY show/movie, and distributes it on their singular massively overpriced service (and yes, with that market stranglehold, they would massively overprice it)
Shouldn’t the principle of competition mean there are multiple services, each trying to present better content? People reasonably contend with only being subscribed to a few they care about - I don’t know who is assuming they should get access to all media, all the time, without paying truckloads of money.
I will grant that for games, no service beats Steam, but I will absolutely buy games from other platforms like Itch and GOG in the spirit of competition when their prices or better or the dev has avoided Steam for reasons of adult content censorship.
I made that point short to be pithy, but what I actually take issue with in there being so many streaming services is that:
- Upfront transparency for what shows and movies are actually there, let alone in what state, is often incredibly limited. This isn’t inherent to there being multiple services, but when I haven’t found one whose experience isn’t profoundly shitty, I’m counting it against them.
- Even if you accurately assess which subscriptions you need at first, that can collapse at any time because shows are treated as playing cards, and you often need to put ongoing effort beyond just paying money into maintaining that list. (I often watch shows over months or years instead of binging them, and this is super shitty under a streaming service.)
- Even if you have all those subscriptions and maintain them well, there’s no place to centrally view their content, something which cable TV – for what a piece of shit it was – shockingly made easier than streaming. If I purchase half my games from Steam and half from GOG, I can still access what I buy from a shared location: my desktop. If I purchase a bunch of discs from multiple different vendors, it’s all centralized on my DVD rack. The UI is consistent (and even slightly quicker to access). This isn’t massive, but it’s still objectively a point against them.
- Unlike the PC gaming landscape where games are often available across multiple stores, streaming services are becoming increasingly exclusivity-focused, and this happens because there’s such an oligopoly in the TV and film industry, and basically every member of that oligopoly now runs a streaming service.
I don’t think the point should be that there should be one streaming service to rule them all, but that in their current state, they represent an objectively substantial downgrade to piracy even taking away costs.
Interesting that you pick GOG and Itch as examples, because I have all my gemes from these platforms available Through Lutris in a central interface. And it works well because Lutris can, provided my login info, just download and install the games without needing any extra services.
I am a willing kleptomaniac
⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⡿⠿⠿⠿⠿⠿⢿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿ ⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⠿⠟⠛⠉⠡⢤⣀⣒⠈⢙⡓⠠⠀⠀⠈⠙⢿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿ ⣿⣿⣿⡟⢁⠐⢦⣌⠲⣌⡲⢦⣍⣛⠲⣬⣙⠢⠑⠶⣄⠀⢻⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿ ⣿⣿⣿⢀⡀⠈⠐⠈⠑⠀⠉⠂⣈⣉⣓⣀⣈⣠⣄⣠⣌⣀⡈⢿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿ ⣿⣿⠇⠾⠿⠷⠤⠈⣿⡆⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣷⡘⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿ ⣿⠇⠐⠾⠛⠛⠿⣷⡘⣧⠹⡿⠟⣛⠻⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣧⢸⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿ ⣿⡦⢠⢤⠀⠀⠀⡈⢁⣿⡀⠀⠰⠌⠁⢹⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⢸⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿ ⡿⢡⣇⣿⣶⣶⣾⣿⣿⠟⠃⠀⠀⣿⠂⢸⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⢃⣾⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿ ⠃⢿⠿⢯⡙⡿⠿⣿⠋⠀⠀⢰⡀⠉⠠⠿⠿⠿⠿⠿⠛⠛⣡⣾⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿ ⣿⠀⠀⠀⠀⠁⠀⠀⠀⠁⢄⣈⠢⠀⢳⣶⣶⣾⣿⣿⠇⣾⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿ ⣿⣷⡄⠀⠀⠀⠀⢠⠀⠠⣄⠀⢀⡀⢸⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⡆⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿ ⣿⡟⠀⡀⠃⠀⠀⣀⠰⠆⢼⡆⠐⢀⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣷⡘⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿ ⣿⠂⠀⠀⡀⣆⠀⠸⣀⠁⠈⠃⣠⣾⣿⣿⣿⡿⠟⠋⠉⠁⠈⠉⠻⢿⣿⣿⣿⣿ ⣿⡀⠁⢠⡅⠘⠰⠀⢈⡄⣺⣿⣿⣿⡿⠟⠉⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠈⠻⢿⣿ ⣿⣿⣦⣤⣬⣤⣴⠞⠀⠓⠛⠛⠉⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⣀⣠⣤⣤ ⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⡏⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⣀⣠⣴⣶⣾⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿ ⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣇⢀⣀⣀⣀⣀⣀⣀⣠⣤⣴⣾⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿⣿If buying isn’t owning, piracy isn’t theft. It is something else.
I just view it as a “try before you buy”. I have loads of CDs and DVDs that I wouldn’t have bought if I hadn’t seen how good they were first.
If I try something and don’t like it then I shouldn’t have to pay for it.
This is the problematic view here. You think the monetary value is attached to the product itself, when it’s actually attached to the perceived satisfaction you thought you would’ve gained before purchasing it.
I don’t understand your reply.
I just don’t want to buy an album based off of one song I heard on the radio and then find out that I don’t like it.
Edit: a downvote and no clarification of what you meant. Thanks I guess. . .
You don’t need to buy albums these days though.
P.S - I didn’t downvote you
I like to buy albums, I think it’s a much better way to support artists than streaming plus I like getting a physical copy, the artwork and the lyrics etc. But that’s another debate and it was more just an example.
P.S. Sorry, the downvote seemed conveniently timed
*bargain also known as 100% discount
Five-finger discount
b-b-but it’s not theft 😢
Right? No justification is required.
Semantically doesn’t matter much.
If a peach seller has a harvest of 1,000 peaches that will go bad in a week, he doesn’t care about “only having 940 peaches” when someone steals 60 of them. He cares that he spent all that effort and money growing the peaches on the bet he’d make a profit, rented the shop space in the market, hired an assistant to bag and sell them, and some douchebag still didn’t pay for them.
The quantity of product a seller maintains is generally almost completely irrelevant to the costs. It’s about the societal expectations of paying your due to people who have put work into something you want.
Ok so alternatively, instead of “stealing” peaches, I pay $10 monthly for Peaches+, which means I get to look at the peaches whenever I want to until they go bad. Sometimes new peaches arrive but they rarely look as good as the previous ones. Then when I eventually cancel my Peaches+ subscription I still don’t own a single peach even though I paid a lot of money.
You Wouldn’t Look At A Peach…
First paragraph addresses the overheads of running a biz.
Second paragraph proffers a specious moral argument.
A connection is vaguely insinuated.
Sloppy.
What if someone richer than the peach grower took a picture of the peaches, and then demanded everyone else pay them instead of the peach grower for copies of the photo of the peaches? Would you still be upset if the peach photographer didn’t make money from every single person who obtained a copy of the photo of the peaches? In some cases, the peach grower got paid before the photo started being sold, in other cases the peach grower gets 0.0004% of the profit from each peach photo sold.
If it’s the photographer’s wish to make money off the photo, and each person who sees it agrees that it’s high value, then yes, I’d be upset about him not making money. If it was so easy to take good photos of peaches, I’d prefer everyone took their own for their eye-catching uses. As it so happens, it’s not so easy.
In fact, it’s extremely hard for photographers to convince clients, even wealthy magazines, to pay for photo licenses.
Classic lemmy logic. Lemme say something ridiculous, but it’s “capitalism bad”, so everyone will upvote.
You’re playing a game, or watching a movie made by labor. Highly qualified and paid labor.
All those involved in the production could easily go and make their own company and do their own movies/games. And they often do. But you keep pirating AAA titles and Hollywood produced movies instead of paying for indie games and watching independent cinema.
That’s because deep in your soul you’re a capitalist hoe, you’re just also a poor joe, but somehow you need to rationalize.
You want the system of capitalist abuse in the media industry to end? Instead of pirating, stop consuming for-profit media, and take your hard earned cash to support independent creators.
Piracy helps that capitalist system. Cuz they’ll abuse everyone they can, and those who can’t will illegally use the results anyways. And this way no independent market will ever form.
You’re not a warrior of freedom, anon. You’re a corpo sucker, just a poor one.
There’s a little concept known as Intellectual Property that begs to differ
If someone steals my bike, I lose ownership of the bike, that’s theft.
If I pirate a movie, Disney still owns the movie.
If I buy a game, I don’t even own that copy of the game??
In my opinion, theft is a bit more nuanced than that. You pirating the game denies the producers of the game the profit they would have otherwise derived from you purchasing the game
no because otherwise I simply wouldn’t have bought it
When people hear the concept of thought crimes described to them, they rightfully recoil in disgust at that kind of dystopic idea. However, euphemize the concept as intellectual property, and for some reason, most people are fine with it.
IP theft isn’t a thought crime, though.
No idea what point buddy was tryna pass across there
I have no idea what a “though crime” is, but if your intent is to antagonise IP laws then you’re probably not a very creative person
They likely meant “thought crimes”
IP isn’t a thought crime though
Because I’m a cheap bastard.
And also because I’m a third worlder and piracy is my only access.
What a great show. I really appreciate this meme.
Over the Garden Wall for those who don’t know. It was a miniseries Cartoon Network did in the 2010s and I agree, it was a really great show.
My friend (an old lady unfamiliar with pirates) bought a dvd the other day. A comedy from 15 years ago.
It had been censored. Offensive dialogue dubbed over. No warning on rhe package.
Yo ho forever.
And it’s good for my financial health
Morality is a great tool for justifying legal enforcement of my desires. All it takes is a good argument connecting the two.
The arguments are getting less good here tho. They’re getting very thin and flimsy.
What would happen if we threw away the moral argument?
What if instead of offering a moral argument for why you shouldn’t pirate their movies, Disney just said “come at me bro”?
Then I would come. And by God would I die stealing the dumbest shit imaginable just for the sake of it
I was just sick of looking through several apps to see if I had access to something.
Why not both?
If purchasing doesn’t convey ownership, copying cannot be theft.
You can also say that you download games from green steam *torrent
