I mean like:
- Chinese (Edit: Mandarin Chinese) will become the lingua franca of the world
- The Internation Aviation Language will (probably) become Chinese (replacing Aviation English)
- Lunar New year becomes a popular holiday (like Chrismas is currently popular worldwide)
- The Internet will use mostly Chinese Chracter
- And instead of 26 Latin based characters, you’ll have to learn thousands of characters, imagine that 😅 (or just use a translator tool 🤷♂️)
- There would be a China version of Hollywood, taking over the original Hollywood
- Fengshui becomes a thing that the world starts to care about
- UN Headquarters now located in Shanghai (I’m guessing this is the most “international” city in China, right?)
- Boeing is dead, some Chinese airplane manufacturer now dominates, competing with Airbus.
- Baidu is default search engine (now with less censorship due to democrarization)
- Harmony OS (Huawei’s Android fork) become the new “Apple”, iPhone is now insignificant, ranking below Motorola in terms of market share.
- Either Windows get brought by some Chinese Bussiness person, or there China makes a Linux distribution that starts off as Open Source with some proprietary components (like how Android is), then eventually becoming Closed Source once they overtake Windows. Lets call it PandaOS (I’m not creative with names 'mmkay)
- etc…
Sounds like an interesting world 🤔
What do you think?
I don’t care which country is the global super power as long as it adhere to the liberal world order and all that comes with it.
I want to leave in peace, enjoy my human rights and not have to worry about other countries using arms to push their will.But also: a lot of those points have nothing to do with who the global super power is
Appendix: maybe I was vague but my answer is that as long as the super power follows the rule-based order (as it is supposed to be obviously) it doesn’t matter who that super power is. China, Russia, USA, Albania, the Vatican, Congo, w/e.
Understand that might does not make right and follow the same rules as the lesser states and I’m happy.But also: a lot of those points have nothing to do with who the global super power is
I mean, Americanization of the world was helped by the fact that US became a global superpower.
Absolutely, soft power is definitely relevant.
A lot of people in the global south might say they don’t want it to adhere to the “liberal world order”
You’re speaking from a position of privilege, and suggesting that you should keep your privilege
I don’t care. The question was if I was okay with China as the super power and my answer is that it don’t matter as long as it adheres to the liberal world order.
Get off your high horse.
“I’m on board with change in the global order as long as we maintain hegemony”
very valuable contribution thank you
Hegemony of whom? Lame ass comment
Hummm the “liberal world order” is 100% “countries” using arms to push their will. Countries being “the west”.
And YOU having “human rights” is not really dependent on the “liberal world order”. Most of your rights were won by blood and tears during the late 1800s and early 1900s, through popular movements mostly ideologically aligned first with anarchism then with communism.
Also, the vast majority of the world not having human rights and being colonized and exploited IS your “liberal world order”.
So not really sure how you specifically benefit from western imperialism, unless you are a billionaire ofc. Which I highly doubt.
adhere to the liberal world order
And YOU having “human rights” is not really dependent on the “liberal world order”. Most of your rights were won by blood and tears during the late 1800s and early 1900s, through popular movements mostly ideologically aligned first with anarchism then with communism.
You are correct in that the liberal world order is an effect of previous hardwon freedoms. What is your point? The LIO makes sure that if my government tries to take these freedoms from me it invokes international support. So a malicious government will not only have to deal with domestic pushback, but international as well.
Also, the vast majority of the world not having human rights and being colonized and exploited IS your “liberal world order”.
…which is why these countries are under sanctions for example. Take Venezuela as a case. But yes, the postcolonial debate is ongoing.
Lmao vuvuzela ok gotcha
What
Oh sorry, didn’t look at your instance. I realize now that you just wanted to shit on the liberal world order, not make a point
Boom got’em
When you say “Chinese” becomes lingua franca, do you mean Mandarin? Cantonese? Yue? Hakka? Other? If Mandarin, do you mean Jilu? Jiaolio? Other?
I don’t think “Chinese” or any sinitic language ever becomes the global language. Translation is becoming so simple, I would expect any new global initiative can work in 3-4 languages simultaneously.
UN headquarters relocating - I think it would be more likely the UN collapses and is replaced by something else with China leading.
The Chinese movie industry is already huge, we just don’t see much of it in the US.
Lots of Chinese people aren’t into fengshui. That’s kind of a bizarre stereotype for you to pick out of everything mentioned.
The aerospace industry in China has a ways to go before they can be classified in the same tier as Airbus. They are getting better, but still heavily rely on borrowing designs instead of creating their own.
Baidu, HarmonyOS, a computer OS - fine by me to add more options.
What I actually hope is the idea of a single global superpower dies completely. It’s not even the current reality for the US; it’s just propaganda.
When you say “Chinese” becomes lingua franca, do you mean Mandarin? Cantonese? Yue? Hakka? Other? If Mandarin, do you mean Jilu? Jiaolio? Other?
Mandarin Chinese. (I had this in mind when I was typing it, but then forgot to type it 😅)
Lots of Chinese people aren’t into fengshui. That’s kind of a bizarre stereotype for you to pick out of everything mentioned.
Idk, my parents are very into it, so I just assumed its a standard thing. The friends that my mom talk to seems to discuss superstitions a lot. My parents wouldn’t buy a house with the number 4 on the street address.
(For Context: My family and I were born in PRC)
I meant more like “Chinese Superstition” rather than just “fengshui”, but the “fengshui” term was more widespread so I just used that instead.
What I actually hope is the idea of a single global superpower dies completely. It’s not even the current reality for the US; it’s just propaganda.
Yea I don’t like superpowers either, but this is more like a “If you had to pick” type of question.
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China already is a superpower
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There can be more than one superpower
Global Superpower
Like pervasive American influence into everything. Military bases everywhere. Hollywood everywhere. Internet is mostly American sites with American users, taking about American politics. But replace all that with China.
China is already like that, just outside the West. Even in the West you’re not going to find a single person that doesn’t have a bit of Chinese goods and/or culture in their daily life.
yeah, it honestly is already like that
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No. Even if they dramatically changed on all fronts, became a democracy, promoted LGBT+ and racial civil rights, broke up their concentration camps, stopped surveiling citizens, gave people true elections, and stopped cracking down on political opponents, their nation is facing an extremely serious gender and population imbalance, one that will have drastic impacts on their society and stability in the next 30 years. A large portion of their workforce is going to retire and cannot be sustained by the smaller population that are kids and teens now. There’s also a severe gender imbalance from the One Child Policy favoring boys over girls. There’s no getting off that train, and shit like incel culture and a ton of retirees causes bad political instability. Or wars, to distract from problems at home, like what Russia is doing.
It’s going to be a massive problem since they don’t have much in the way of immigration, and even if they got a ton of people pregnant now, they are still facing down a 10+ year deficit of people.
Hell, the only reason why we aren’t in the same boat is that we didn’t implement boneheaded policies like that, and immigration helps offset our birthrate being below the replacement rate of people. We depend on immigrants as much as they depend on us.
No because we can and ought to have a world without global superpowers and states overall.
While I’d support china going democratic 100% my experience of working and traveling in china makes me pretty certain it’s not happening in my lifetime. Obedience has been brutally beaten into Chinese citizens for so long it would take a long time to change that
The only issue I see with your plan is keeping the Chinese writing system. Alphabets are superior, even if you write Chinese with them.
Otherwise as long as my ideas about how the world should function get put into practice, I don’t care who does it. By chance of history US was the one who brought quite a few good ideas into the world, mostly in the second half of the 20th century. But there’s nothing fundamentally American about having good ideas.
You can’t write Chinese languages with alphabets, even using tone markers there are too many homophones.
There’s a reason Chinese hasn’t switched to a new writing system the way that Japanese, Korean, Vietnamese, Hmong, and I’m sure other languages, have.
If China becomes democratic it is no longer China anywhere as we know it. The agenda is still, AFAIK, that the totalitarian regime is necessary for another undisclosed amount of time with the end goal to transition into full communism.
The problem is of course that the party elite quite enjoy this position they are in and are in no hurry for any societal transitions in any direction whatsoever.
So, in my mind, your question is at best some imaginary world building for a fictional scenario that has no connection with reality.
I think the point was to have it as a mental exercise. Personally I’d be fine with it. My main issue with China is the entire genocidal surveillance ethnostate with little to no civil liberties and full restricted speech. If it opened up to allow criticism of the government, protests, protection of LGBTQ folks and legal marriage, I’d be more on board.
But yes, that’s not the China we see today and likely never going to see in our lifetimes.
The alternative reality you live in is fascinating.
Would you mind elaborating?
Edit; I got curious and checked out some post history. It’s a tankie. No need to bother then. It will just be arrogance and smug insults and world history that strangely nobody except other tankies find truthful.
Considering they use Uyghur slave labour for Xinjiang cotton, the answer is a no from me.
In an alternate universe where Britain didn’t went and colonise countries, US is so weak they got wrecked and conquered by Japan in ww2, and China become a democratic country at the end of ww2, then yeah i guess i wouldn’t mind because it didn’t matter.
In current universe? None of that will happen, even if a political party suddenly campaign against CCP and CCP suddenly got voted out next election. English doesn’t became a lingua franca overnight.
Democracy without the rest of Enlightenment Liberalism is just another kind of of tyranny.
E: typo
South Korea President Yoon has joined the chat
Former you mean. Well he might technically be president, I don’t follow close enough to know the exact status, but he is politically dead in the country and there is just process left to formalize it.
Which is how it should work. People abusing power is a given. If it isn’t happening where you live than either you are ignorant of the truth (perhaps because you overall support what the abuser is doing and so choose to ignore small signs); or you are afraid of what would happen if you talked about abuse.
I think the main thing which I would have problems with would be the collectivism and confucionism which I really can’t stand. I don’t think it’s necessary to replace English, it’s not American anyway. The rest sounds ok to me, as long as they don’t kill my normal Linux.
collectivism
I mean, Covid would probably be handled better. Look at the democratic Asian countries, they did much better than the US.
I get what you’re saying here, But there are like 3-5 democratic countries in Asia, and even they didn’t fair the best with covid. I think it’s the US that was exceptionally bad, not the countries that handled it greatly.
As for the rest i’d rather live in a flawed liberal democracy than an efficient autocratic dictatorship.
Not worth it in my opinion.
What do you dislike about collectivism?
I can’t stand that everyone is forced by sociaty to be the same.
I’m not like you, I have my own thinking, my own style, by own taste in music, my own taste in food, etc. etc.
I really like diversity. Let’s look at the music from mainly collectivist countries like China or Korea. There is K-pop and uhm I guess that’s all I know (and I live in Korea). Then let’s compare it to the a individualistic country I lived before like Sweden:
- Electronic Body Music
- Metal (with all it’s subgenres)
- Rock
- Pop
- Electronic Dance Music
And each of them have their own subculture. Yeah you get the point.
Wait, you think collectivism is when everyone is forced to listen to the same music? And eat the same things? And dress the same way?
Those seem to be some of the long term results of the parts of conformism like conformity, group priority and social harmony.
Lol okay then
Just a “Lol” no more explanation?
I’d rather have multipolarity.
Even if multipolarity means more war?
I think it means less war. Unfun Fact: Most of the major wars since 1990 wouldn’t have happened if the USSR still existed as a rival to the USA; the latter wouldn’t have dared to intervene in Iraq or Afghanistan, no wars between Azeris and Armenians, or Ukrainians and Russians, since they all would be part of the same country.
To be fair, Chinese is only slightly harder to learn than English
That depends on where you are coming from. English has enough German and Latin roots that most of Europe has a head start when learning English. (linguists will define roots different from what I’m using and say English doesn’t have Latin roots, but there is still significant influence)
If you are coming from an African language though it probably won’t make much difference. Though in Africa there is a good chance your nation was controlled by Europe over the years and so you might know enough of some European language to make English easier.
Basic Mandarin is actually pretty easy.
Becoming even day to day fine doesn’t take long and has fewer tricks.
Getting good enough to read literate classics, or use 成语 in your speech though takes a long time and effort.
That reading and speaking are basically independent skills though is odd to folks used to Alphabetic languages.
That depends on how they act. China right now is on a path where I’d oppose them replacing the US. However the EU has the ability to replace the US as the global superpower - they don’t because despite some significant differences overall the US and EU get along well and so they don’t see any point. By cooperating the EU gains the things they want from being a global superpower without the disadvantages. Part of that cooperation is the EU is in NATO (mostly?) and so they are paying some of the military costs of the US being a global super power.
The US isn’t perfect by any means, but we have done much better in many ways vs previous global superpowers. Right now I’d predict China would be worse so I oppose it. However who knows how things will change in the future.
