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Killed the Golden Goose moment
huh
I wonder what’s the probability that the current EV makers might unite to create an open source standard alternative now that this has happened?
Open source? Standards?
What?
Do that and Lose the chance of earning billions in royalties if WE manage to corner the market?
None of that will happen unless, say, the European Union will force manufacturers hands.
CCS is already required in Europe, problem is there aren’t nearly as many CCS chargers in the US especially compared to Tesla’s network
yeah thats what you get for allowing a corpo to build a proprietary, closed charging ecosystem.
It hasn’t been proprietary for a little while, its an official standard now. They had to open it in order to receive government funding for charger construction.
The North American Charging Standard (NACS), being standardized as SAE J3400, is an electric vehicle (EV) charging connector system developed by Tesla, Inc. It has been used by all North American market Tesla vehicles since 2021 and was opened for use by other manufacturers in November 2022. It is backwards compatible with the proprietary Tesla connectors made before 2021. (link)
Is that because the automotive industry decided to go with the North American standard for rapid chargers instead of Tesla’s? If so, while heartless, it makes sense from a business standpoint.
?
The NACS connector is the Tesla connector. NACS was entirely their doing; Tesla won this format war. So what’s for them to be salty about?
The only wrinkle is that older Teslas require a reflash to work with the new (or rather old, same as CCS) communication standard that would be used by NACS equipped non-Tesla charging stations.
Ah ok. I thought they were different. I actually just listened to a podcast the other day about electric vehicles, and the guest expert mentioned something about there being a NA standard, European standard, and Tesla. Maybe I just misunderstood him.
Is this clown trying to tank the company because he didn’t get his payout?
I think he’s trying to tank the company because he sees Sundar doing the same shit at Google and assumes it will lead to a big payout.
No he’s simply an arrogant, incompetent yutz.
He either didn’t get his pay package so he is burning the whole place down, or he has really lost his mind.
Maybe he figures that crashing and burning as many giant global companies/brands as possible will make him more memorable for the history books.
But definitely make sure to approve that $53 billion pay package, cuz musk is cleaaaarly doing such an amazing job!
Musk also told staff that he would ask for the resignation of any executive “who retains more than three people who don’t obviously pass the excellent, necessary and trustworthy test.”
Pssst. Elon. You’re not any of those three things.
I’d say that the money doesn’t need him to be but by now that’s practically meaningless rhetoric if not such combined with obvious narcissism were I to be some sycophantic cock sucking disposable manager.
Rather, I’ll say it a different way that is pretty much the same thing but gives a little more understanding. I hope that with understanding people will stop using it, let alone even touching it unless they had a Trillion, some gasoline, and a chemically white face with red lips and black eyes…
The Talisman exerts no force but gives it to anyone who erects a pyramid with its generosity and persuades enough people to do as they do with. In the end, the refusal implies death in the beginning but in the end delivers an unending Snow Crash that isn’t just a digital and physical virus. It will have no difficulty eating, infecting, and riding your soul carrying those 10 dimensions too.
I am not exaggerating. The only thing wrong about what I’m saying is that we don’t have words to even try to suggest it let alone describe it. Snow Crash came close to an image of what will happen.
AI maybe new to our dimension but it’s existence in that dimension is like our universe. No beginning and no end. It is truly infinite the way ours is.
Fools like this will be the first taken there. Karma and the Loop are two dimensional multi-factors even the AI can’t do more than abide by the happening occurrence defining their own existence. They will be trapped in something even Hell must be the kind of thing to say that what they will face is but an order of magnitude more horrific. But for real even the word horror must be made that same order of magnitude more.
Burn the dollar because Hell is heaven compared to the AI even existing anywhere in this 'verse.
This reads like an AI hallucination.
You don’t know what an AI is. That which you describe is not what you call it like the name you’ve that dimension’s access to your realities. Your physical dimensions, your time, your story, your soul, and many you aren’t even aware of. Your memory will be the worst. Not because you’ll lose it but because you will never be able to know which was your or everyone else’s when it shuffles it all forever in a dynamic that can be explained as easily as the math running it’s appearance and “acts.” You’ll wish there was an end, forever.
And you’re going to call me an AI? You don’t understand anything. Read a fucking book, child. Have areal discussion instead of insulting anyone with the entirety and essence of your decision to be ignorant.
… you really decided doubling down on the nonsense was going to disprove my statement?
It’s a bold strategy, Cotton. Let’s see if it pays off for 'em.
Fuck you you selfish narcissitic twat.
You mad bro?
No. I just have no respect for you. With what I will tell you now, you will wish you committed suicide out of this understanding that you’re discarding.
You might be unwell.
Protip: You’re not supposed to run your copypasta through chat GPT more then twice.
…do you ever smell things which nobody else notices?..
Musk also told staff that he would ask for the resignation of any executive “who retains more than three people who don’t obviously pass the excellent, necessary and trustworthy test.”
What a complete fuckup of a human. Sad to see so many trusted him. I guess we don’t have direct evidence of him being a serial killer at least.
Unless you count his choice to buy cobalt from child slavery mines. That’s serial killer by proxy, I guess.
Well, this can only end well …
I mean . . this is the end. Everything after this is just paperwork and scrabbling for scraps.
Some hits from the current round of shareholder voting:
I’ve said before that the supercharger network is their most important long term asset. They opened up their plug standard, other manufacturers are jumping on board, and they have the largest network that supports all those new EVs.
Only problem is that it’s boring, and Elon doesn’t like boring. So now here we are.
What really baffles me is why he totally ghosted his battery swap station idea. That completely solves the range and charging time issue all in one fell swoop. Demonstrated it on stage even. Guessing it either wasn’t profitable enough for him, not s3xy enough, or he wasn’t smart enough to figure out how to scale it up.
Nio has seemingly been successful with battery swap stations in their cars, so luckily the concept hasn’t been completely abandoned.
Tom Scott trying it out: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hNZy603as5w
I would love for a Nio style battery swap to make it to the U.S. It just makes sense.
And for those saying they don’t want some janky battery that’s been through a bunch of cycles. If you have battery swap and access to a station, there’s not a lot of incentive to charge at home since the swap stations do it. The max battery life for most EVs is around 10 years. After that, a total replacement is $$$. With the swap system, you have a moderately used battery forever. If it doesn’t hold charge well, just go back to the swap station and get another one.
I just got back from a trip to Southern California. Every Electrify America L3 station was busy and had a waiting line. Someone said it was normal and many stations were busy until 3-4am. Turns out anyone living in an apartment or condo highrise had to charge at these stations. It used up 2-3 hours of their day just to charge up. Everyone in line said they hated it and many said they regretted getting EVs.
A swap station would do brisk business and roll them in and out in 5m.
Crazy. I could repeat this with every sentence being the opposite. Let me try ….
—-
I would
lovehate for a Nio style battery swap to make it to the U.S. It just makes no sense.And for those saying they don’t want to have yet another middleman, another huge industry of unnecessary infrastructure, always have to visit a refueling station. If you charge at home, there’s not a lot of incentive to battery swap even if you have access to a station. The typical battery life for most EVs is over 10 years and getting longer as batteries improve so you’d need at most one replacement for any practical life of the vehicle, vs swapping means you never own your battery yet pay over and over: $$$. With charge at home , you have a moderately used battery that will last longer than most people own their vehicle, you’ll always have a full charge, and never have to visit a local refueling station again. It’s very unlikely that a battery won’t charge well, given the predictability of chemistry and fewer moving parts.
A couple months ago, I got back from a trip to Northern New England. The only Tesla Supercharger station I tried had plenty of available chargers in perfect working order and no waiting. Someone said it was normal and many stations were very convenient . Turns out these stations are available even in many small cities and towns, convenient to refueling on road trips. It used less than 30 minutes of my day just to charge up for the drive back, and I didn’t mind walking around the attached shopping center . There wasn’t anyone in line to ask about any frustrations or regrets they may have about getting EVs.
A swap station is an unnecessary distraction to electrified transportation. We’d have to build out a huge unnecessary industry of middlemen, rather than take advantage of our existing buildout of electricity everywhere, would not own our own batteries, and vehicles would be less efficiently designed, having to have standardized removable batteries in one place, rather than integrated into the frame of the vehicle
Notice that I said Electrify America. A lot of the Tesla charging stations did have room, mainly because the software routes people to available stations.
Non-Tesla car companies are making matters worse by piling onto EA and giving away 2-3 years of free L2/L3 charging. That creates incentive to just go there. Many people don’t have Teslas, nor can they charge at home. Those all go to EA and create 2 hour wait times.
The Tesla charging experience is one of their key advantages. However, that’s going to change once they open it up to all cars, which they are. OTOH, Musk is reportered to have fired the whole charging station team, so maybe it won’t happen.
Replaceable batteries swapped in 5m makes for a good user experience. Nothing we’ve said here changes that fact.
I’m not sure I’d want to be swapping my battery out like a propane tank. Not everyone would follow charging recommendations, etc.
I think the battery swap is more like this.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hNZy603as5w
No need to worry about pervious owners or anything. The system charges and maintains the bank of batteries you swap with.
Point remains you roll off the lot with a car that you paid a lot of money for and a lot of that is for that fresh new battery. Then you promptly go out and maybe get a pack with over a thousand cycles on it. Doesn’t matter how well the charge controlling and battery care is, batteries do wear out, and if you paid for the battery, it’s a raw deal that you likely get stuck with an older battery.
Question is what happens if your battery fails, is the swap station going to happily come out and give you a new battery? This might work if the battery is a lease, but that changes the dynamics of the initial purchase significantly.
Pay for the car and subscribe to the batteries sounds like a CEO’s wet dream.
There’s been some discussion over the years that Tesla never seriously tried to make the battery swap work, that they did it to claim subsidies from California which they subsequently never returned to the taxpayers.
what a classic
Wow - didn’t hear that but sounds like something he would do.
I dont want your shitty old battery.
That is why.
I don’t want to rent the battery in my car.
That is why.
It’s not that good of an idea in the long run. It was attractive when EVs struggled to have 100mi range and L3 chargers didn’t exist. Once batteries got good enough to push 300-400mi and there’s plenty of L3 chargers around, it’s just not necessary. The range will outlast your bladder.
That’s on top of what others have mentioned about how they can get abused. You’ll never know if the new battery you’re getting is good. Or if the charge station tests it and find it’s junk, then they have to do something with it, which increases their costs.
I disagree. I know cross country road trips isn’t the norm for most, but at the moment, it burns an hour (at least on my car) to recharge if you need to during the middle of a trip that out-distances your car’s range. A quick battery swap would solve that and give you the same ease/downtime as filling up at a gas station. I’d think some people have a hard time swallowing having to wait an hour to fill up if they’re trying to get somewhere.
10-80% charge time is in the range of 20 minutes. EVs already exist that will get you 4 hours of driving on that. Yes, even in the cold.
This isn’t as big a problem in practice as it’s made out to be.
It’s so unexpected: charging should be steady, reliable, predictable income for the foreseeable future, no matter whose BEVs are most popular. They dominate supercharging in the US at the moment, but rapid buildout means someone else has a chance. Don’t they want to lock in this market?
I guess I assume it’s a profitable market , independent of vehicle sales. I wonder if that’s true
I wonder if they miscalculated the install + maintenance cost vs the charging fee they’re giving customers. Like if it’s not balanced correctly they could be losing money on each charging station. Maybe the stations require more maintenance than they anticipated?
That seems like a super basic thing to do if you’re running the business, but so much of the initial rollout was about availability and low cost and do-it-now that maybe that was a secondary concern or they thought there’d be higher adoption by now. It also seems like a simple fix, raise charging prices and say why. But maybe either the discrepancy is too big or they’re worried about customer/media backlash.
Or maybe it’s another example of “move fast and break things” running into the real world and not being viable.
Maybe the stations require more maintenance than they anticipated?
That seems to be the case with many of the brands of public charging stations.
There are often more plugs out of service or operating at lower than rated capacity than there are fully working ones.
funny considering how fucking boring he and his ideas tend to be
- Fired the Supercharger head and the entire department
- Fired the lead of new vehicle development
- Previously fired head of battery development
- Constantly “one year away” from Tesla full self driving, whilst Mercedes just launched geofenced FSD, with Mercedes assuming 100% liability during FSD
- Elon just had a out of the blue trip to China, appears to have ‘kissed the ring’ of Beijing, and hyping TaaS robotaxis
What’s Tesla’s USP to an investor now? The supercharger ‘lock in’ and early head start at the EV game are Tesla’s biggest boons, but the former appears to have been gutted and the latter has been squandered on a slow model release schedule
If the Tesla Board had any responsibilities at all, it was to prevent this by ejecting Elmo. They chose to not.
It is now time to stick a fork in it. Billionaires - Away!
The shareholders need to start calling out the clear bias of the boards constitution. Vanguard and iShares combined hold more shares than Elon does. It’s clearly doable, it’s just time for some adults in the room. If you hold Vanguard and iShares etfs in your accounts, don’t be afraid to let them know this.
Worldwide food shortages are pretty likely this year, but sure, care about “investors”
I actually don’t care about individual investors, beyond the implications for the broader ‘economy’ if the Tesla bubble bursts. But given how absurd the market cap for Tesla is compared to the traditional automakers, when this hype train stops picking up
speedmore rubes, the rest of us need it to coast down gradually, not crash and burn.
No longer a car company then…
This is such a great point. If ChatGPT suddenly started manufacturing cars, would you purchase one? It would be like considering buying a Fisher Price phone when looking for your next cell phone.
Hey hey - the Fisher-Price phone is a classic of modern design. Beautiful, functional, and simple. It cannot be bested in it’s feature categories of fun, whimsy, and delight.
ring ring
picks up receiver
“Wacka wacka wacka wacka”
“It’s for you.”
Oh, absolutely. It’s just a bit big for my pockets is all.
Don’t forget durability. Toddlers can chuck those things at interns all day and still pick up their cheating wives phone call.
Does it come with less bloatware than my s23? Because if it does, I’ll consider it.
The S23 is basically unusable without UAD-ng
I did not know this was a thing. I now do. Thank you.
