You must log in or register to comment.
Incline if use of shades of greys in diagrams instead of easily identifiable colours: up 500%
46 Shades of Grey Short
That sex is even considered a vice on the same level as drugs and violence is fucking bonkers.
This graph alone gives legitimacy to this idea. Nudity and sex are completely normal (and necessary) things in life. That something that is needed for everyone reading this to exist being labeled as a vice like violence and drugs is actually disgusting IMHO.
So is peeing and shitting. And yet somehow you don’t get a 5 minute scene of someone on a shitter and then the exact shot of their turds being flushed down.
Sex and nudity are normal. And yet I don’t wanna watch my friends have sex. Do you? Wierd huh?
So, why exactly is it so unbelievable that people just don’t wanna watch actors pretend to do the most intimate thing we all got?
Feels awkward, yes. Feels akward when it’s bad and feels even more awkward when it’s good. And it would be most akward if they actually properly showed the entire process and it was real.
Shitting and peeing is not being cathegorized as a vice, unlike sex!
Nice strawmen you got there. I never said anything actually about the use in film nor did I say anything about personal preference.
I protest the idea of categorizing sex and nudity as vices at the same level as drugs and violence. That is something the graph presupposes by comparing to these and actually labeling sex as a vice.
Of course one could have a discussion on when and how sexuality in media should be depicted but not under the premise that sex is a vice.
Edit: Surely you would agree that defecating is not a vice? No one should tell someone they should not shit. Or you should be ashamed of shitting.
No one says shitting is on the same level as taking drugs or beating someone to death.
So why do people lump sex in with violence and drugs.
You are thinking of it wrong… Why would these bitches be having sex when they could be working a corpo making daddy some mother fucking money?!
Sex scenes in movies are a combination of this weird shameful “I want to show I’m having sex but I can’t actually show it” and “It’s almost like porn if you removed all the porn.”
You’re really stuck in a pointless awkward middle ground that satisfies nobody. And 95% of the time it isn’t even plot relevant so you’re just wasting time. The decline basically just coincides with internet access to the masses.
Yes, but why? Sex is an important part of human life and relationships, it influences people’s behaviour and decisions, yet it’s being depicted less and less and often not in a satisfying way. So why doesn’t it get depicted in a meaningful and plot relevant way? A good recent example that it can be done is The Poor Things (sexuality is one of the main topics there and is depicted and talked about very openly).
I correlate it with the weird feelings that religion introduced about sex and let Al Pacino speak my feelings in Devil’s Advocate:
“let me give you a little inside information about God. God likes to watch. He’s a prankster. Think about it. He gives man instincts. He gives you this extraordinary gift, and then what does He do? I swear, for His own amusement, His own private cosmic gag reel, He sets the rules in opposition. It’s the goof of all time. Look, but don’t touch. Touch, but don’t taste. Taste, don’t swallow.”
I want Dennis Reynolds to direct. That way any sex scenes will show full penetration and actually be worth having in.
To hell with bra-on sex, duvet covering the lower half of the bodies sex, very dark room sex. Depict it artistically with full nudity and penetration. Show the sex in a way that people actually have sex.
That would be refreshing in a mainstream movie.
how about marionette sex? cause the extended version of Team America World Police has like 3 minutes of uncensored doll sex and it is hilarious
It reminds me about the sex scene from Family Guy
as an asexual person i find other people’s opinions on this interesting. the sex scenes do nothing for me and i’m usually just waiting for them to end but i understand my circumstances are not common. i can only assume that someone who is into sex gets something out of sex scenes, otherwise they wouldn’t exist.
what i don’t understand is the demonizing of sex scenes in movies. like does everyone only watch movies with their parents/kids? i don’t like sex scenes due to my asexuality and i’m glad that there are few of them because this cultural shift benefits me specifically (who has never been in the target demographic) in a roundabout way. but i wouldn’t say they are all gross/unnecessary/graphic/etc as a blanket statement like i see people in this thread and other places online say. art doesn’t need to be for everyone.
HuH, I feel like I’m in a minority at least in this thread. I’m definitely interested in the sex scenes. It doesn’t matter how easy it is to find porn, because that’s not in universe nor even “how far” they go on screen since things can be implied. A movie with sexual tension, progressing toward sex is interesting, and external porn is irrelevant to that plot.
Of course that assumes it fits the movie somehow. I definitely agree some sex scenes were just inserted for the prurient interest and really shouldn’t be there. Then again, there are bad films saved only by random appearances of boobs
So sex is a vice now or just when its in a film?
All the colors in the fucking universe and they pick three shades of gray.
It’s due to easier accessibility to porn. It both reduces demand for the relatively timid sex scenes in films and also reduces their edginess/shock value.
Yeah, but I think sex scenes don’t need any shock value or compete with porn. They can depict the many ways sex influences people irl.
Tv shows took the sex thing
They have enough time to develop a plot where the sex actually makes sense instead of forced in
Is the spike in the early 2000’s from the cinematic masterpiece The Room? Three sex scenes in the span of like 15 minutes, ooh la la.
Seriously though, as much of a horndog I can be, I like the decline of random sex scenes in movies. Very rarely added anything to the story for me. I’m not a fan of violence, but fortunately it’s not too hard to avoid.
Three sex scenes using footage from only one lmao
That Tommy Wiseau was truly a visionary.
Yeah, my bet is that sex used to be this thing you rarely see, so seeing it in a movie was this interesting event. Now we have access to more porn than you could possibly ever consume at your fingertips. Sex in movies used to sell a movie. Now I don’t think anyone really cares.
Some people are seeing this and assuming sex has become more divisive so they stopped showing it. I’m almost certain it’s the opposite. No one cares anymore.
spike in the early 2000s*
You’re tearing me apart, Lisa!
Every, every, every-day 🎶
Lovin’, touchin’, squeezin’
You are my rose you are my rose you are my rose…
My question would be how much of this is actors no longer being completely subjected to the gross wims of the director. How many scenes had little to do with a story and felt more like the director using the opportunity to make pretty people obey them.
We have intimacy directors now and what may also be happening is individuals having more say in production and in their bodily autonomy and I don’t see that as an issue particularly.
Did random sex scenes really hit the level of art for you folks? Is pornography art the same way? 🤔 You know both are made for mass sale and consumption usually, the same way, much more than trying to make content to say anything.
But um “it so bad we block the titties!” or whatever is popular to say. Even though i personally don’t remember many that added anything story related. Show me them bonding in a real way, sex doesn’t cement anything if you’ve ever had a cheating partner, but a real collection of moments spent together between them that shows understanding and sacrifice for each other can really have an impact.
Even cheating can have an impact (mostly negative) and in general, sex or even the absense thereof influences our life and therefore is worth depicting in a movie. Bad sex scenes are as awkward and boring as bad action scenes. Both can be done well and be plot relevant or artistic.
Do you have a movie or show as an example specifically or just a general “can”?
I do have many movies specifically, from the top of my head: the Poor Things, Brokeback Mountain, Breaking the Waves, the 5th Element (where it’s just for fun and it’s ok), the English Patient.
The kids who watched Titanic with their parents are growing up and making movies now
My brain just go … when random awkward 30 second sex scene happens out of nowhere or they just start making out, kissing and moaning loudly then suddenly we are in the next scene and everything is back to normal. Why?
Unless the film is sexual in nature random full frontal nudity, stray tits, stray ass, visible privates always makes me so confused.
It’s purely in the film so producers can tell young actresses to get naked for the “job interview” cause it’s part of the film.
The fact that those useless sex scenes aren’t in films as often anymore is a good sign.Yes i am glad i am seeing less of those useless sex scenes. In my opinion implied sex is better than graphical sex scene most of the time. You don’t need to see them have sex to know that they did and it will get the point across just the same to the audience without all the awkward and cringey aspect that comes with two actors playing pretend.
Okay, but what makes it “random” to you? It’s art. Nudity in art has been around since art began—took a few years off for puritanical reasons, sure, but we’re all human, we all share having a naked body in common. And sex is the most natural thing. So to include it in art is just as natural.
Our attitudes toward it have changed. Why, though? What makes you feel awkward about seeing sex or nudity
I get art. But there are alot of nudity in the mainstream films that are not that. If i want to watch sex there is porn. If i want nudity in art those exist too.
Don’t you feel awkward watching two actors play pretend? Or having your 5.1 audio system start moaning in a film when you are not expecting those type of content. Random naked body parts i don’t mind those but often time you can remove those and nothing of value will be lost. So my question is why?
Do I feel awkward watching two actors act? No. Do you?
My point is, what makes you guys so uncomfortable with sex? Doesn’t that strike you as a little odd? Watching a movie with superfluous sex scenes with, say, your family, is definitely weird. But not because of the sex, but because you’re watching sex with your family there and that is awkward.
Everyone keeps saying “if I want to see sex, I’ll watch porn.” But that’s…such a weird take, I think. It’s not about getting turned on by sex scenes or trying to get off. It’s just a portrayal of a pretty massive part of life that everyone seems scared of or something. I just don’t get that.
When it comes to surprise sex scene yes. The whole thing is just awkward. But when i am watching a film and i am expecting it to happen then no.
Uncomfortable with sex? No. My point was I don’t want to be watching an action movie and get a surprise sex scene that last too long and add nothing to the story. Maybe i am weird but clearly i am not the only one that appreciate a good film without those unnecessary sex scene. Otherwise we wouldn’t be seeing a steep decline of sex in films.
Maybe it does all come down to whether you think most sex scenes are randomly inserted to sell the movie, or are actually connected to the plot or character development. Clearly there are both, and which dominates might be related to what each of us watches
I watch all kind of films and I have no issues with the latter. It is a good thing we are getting less of those unnecessary sex scene that add nothing to the story, plot or character development.
This is a benefit of sex being ubiquitous: you have to try a lot harder for shock value
Well I dunno if people not liking it is the reason we’re seeing a steep decline. If that were the case, we’d be seeing a steep decline in shitty movies. And that line is trending the other way.
I personally think it’s more a sort of return to Puritanism—in some respects. People are, in fact, very touchy these days. I mean, the intention is good in those touchy people. We want to see less exploitation, see less offensive or unequal treatment of people. And that’s great. But I don’t think sex in film is inherently exploitative nor does it necessitate unequal treatment.
But you know what else we’re seeing? A steep decline in young people having sex. Millennials were the generation having the least sex, until gen Z came along. Now they’re the generation having the least sex (in adolescence/young adulthood). I personally think there’s a connection there, too. We are more wary of anything that might get people upset—well, I say “we” but really I mean the capitalists. They want your money and will be as inoffensive as they think is necessary to get it. So really, what we’re seeing is a capitalist response to a seemingly more sensitive consumer.
And that’s just shitty all around. Thanks once again, capitalism.
Roughly correlates with the rate of decrease in people 18-30 having sex. I’m not sure of the order of influence there, or if there even is one, but it’s possible the declining presence of sex in media is a result of it being less relatable for something like 30% more young people than previous generations.
Is this what it feels like to be color blind and have people show you charts? Who the hell puts all the other comparison metrics in gray scale?
What are you taking about? It is in colour.
i think it was prevalent before the interwebs because there was largely few places to get porn, and throwing it in a movie meant more eyeballs.
as porn became immediately available in other forms (mostly the internet), the unnecessary scenes could be eliminated as a waste of time and a detraction from plots. they ceased being a reason to draw eyeballs.
You telling me this wasn’t relevant to the plot?
What the fuck movie is this?
Scary Movie
What’s this?
Scary Movie
This is the first one.
What’s scary movie 2 got up its sleeve.
You can get gratuitous violence on the internet, too. Far more than the most violent slasher film. Availability isn’t the reason.
the desire for gratuitous violence is probably orders of magnitude less sought for than our sex drive.
sex is so much more of a psycho-social driver than violence as to make your assumption invalid.
e. i would also add slasher films are slasher films. they arent regular movies with slasher film parts thrown in to attract as many eyeballs as possible. they were written to attract people into that niche thing.
If it’s not as desirable, then why would it be so prevalent in movies?
it isnt. its your own confirmation bias.
gratuitous [unnecessary] sex scenes are/were in an incredibly larger number of movies than the violence i think youre referring to.
Uh, the graph in OP says otherwise. I guess it depends on your definition of “gratuitous”.
Is James Bond shooting his way through badies–without a drop of blood being shown–gratuitous? How does that compare to a flash of boobs on screen in another movie?
that why i mentioned it depends on the type of violence. it was mentioned ‘slasherfilms’ which i find is an entirely different level compared to james bond.
i dont think that level has changed much at all. movies that require action, still have that nonsense.
you dont see sites advertsing short form violence like pornhub. its apples/oranges.
Would you say that the conversion of TV from broadcast/cable to streaming has resulted in a lot more nudity? If so, why hasn’t Internet porn reduced it?
Here’s the point I’ve been circling around: the availability of Internet porn does not adequately explain why depictions of sex and nudity in movies have gone down. It’s the first idea that pops into peoples head, but it doesn’t quite fit. What does is the rating system. Somewhat with the introduction of PG-13, and more dramatically so with NC-17. “This Movie Is Not Yet Rated” goes into this in more detail, but I’ll lay out what it’s getting at.
If you go back to the 1970s and '80s, you have PG movies with nudity. “Airplane”, released 1980, had a quick flash of boobs along with an extended blowjob joke. “Superman”, released 1978, had Superman as a kid climbing naked out of that pod. Expressly non-sexual, but nudity none the less. Today, Airplane would go straight to an R rating for that flash of boobs unless it’s from a director like James Cameron, who gets to pull strings and do whatever they want. I don’t think you could do the Superman bit at all.
You also have some R rated movies at the time showing extended closeups of the faces of women in sexual pleasure. This has almost entirely disappeared from all mainstream movies. Liv Taylor’s character in “Jersey Girl” (PG-13) talks about masturbating, and that was scandalous.
Then PG-13 shows up in 1984 in response to movies like “Indiana Jones and the Temple of Doom” pushing PG too far. When that happens, PG becomes the older kids movie rating, and PG-13 is supposedly for teenagers. Except, now you can’t really do scenes like Temple of Doom did and still be PG-13, either. Too much blood. Plus, you can’t have nudity except maybe the odd butt (usually male), again with the exception of being James Cameron.
Also, you get one F-bomb in PG-13 movies. It has to be stated in anger (“fuck you”) and not in reference to sex (“Should we go home and fuck each others brains out”). This isn’t an official rule anywhere, but even people outside the industry have picked up on it.
So now you can have James Bond shooting up tons of baddies as long as you don’t show any blood. The same movie will also go to great lengths to carefully conceal the lead actresses’ nipples at all times.
This gets much worse when NC-17 comes along. This was an attempt to rebrand the X rating, which tended to be associated with outright porn. “XXX” was never an MPAA rating; the porn industry adopted that for itself, but the association got stuck. So hey, surrender that idea to porn, change X to NC-17, and now we can make “serious” movies with lots of sex.
Showgirls then completely bombs.
What happens next is that NC-17 is used as a bludgeon by the ratings board. Do what we say, or else we’ll rate you NC-17 and most of the theaters won’t even show your movie. There’s a bit of psychology going on here where the ratings board wants to feel like they have a say in the movie itself. This has sometimes resulted in directors deliberately putting in stuff they know will never pass, then it gets flagged by the ratings board, they drop it, and the ratings board gives it the OK.
You can’t always do that, though. Directors won’t bother shooting a scene at all when they think the ratings board will nix it. Nudity has become nearly absent from R rated movies altogether because of this, and it’s a very brief flash if it’s there at all. One exception being Wolf of Wallstreet. Directed by Martin Scorsese–another director who has enough pull to get whatever they want. Anybody less than an S-tier director doesn’t get to do that. That movie is now 11 years old, and I’d challenge you to find another R rated movie with that much nudity and sex that’s been produced since.
Violence in R rated movies hasn’t gone the same way, because the ratings board members don’t care as much. They’re largely Americans (as far as we know; they were when “This Movie Is Not Yet Rated” was produced), and American culture is stuck in a mindset that violence is less bad than nudity. Also, Showgirls was known for sex, not violence, and that’s the sack of bricks hanging over every R rated movie director.
So in a perverse way, the opening of PG-13 and NC-17 ratings have actually reduced artistic expression, not opened it up.
Streaming evolved in a totally different way, and isn’t subject to the same incentives.
I wish the graph went back another twenty years so we could see whether the timeframe matches your hypothesis.
